1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:07,000 Downloaded from YTS.MX 2 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:13,000 Official YIFY movies site: YTS.MX 3 00:00:45,320 --> 00:00:47,560 [Camera shutters clicking] 4 00:00:48,080 --> 00:00:50,040 [Shouting] 5 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:54,000 [Man] What's your name? Where are you from? 6 00:00:57,480 --> 00:00:59,000 Can I get your first name? 7 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:24,320 Punched and kicked by anti-gay protesters in Moscow today. 8 00:01:24,400 --> 00:01:26,520 [Peter] Someone, protect me. Someone, protect me. 9 00:01:26,600 --> 00:01:28,680 Before being arrested by police. 10 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:33,480 Being the target of a violent attack comes with the territory. 11 00:01:33,560 --> 00:01:35,640 Ladies and gentlemen, Peter Tatchell. 12 00:01:35,720 --> 00:01:39,000 Stop homophobia in the Commonwealth! 13 00:01:39,080 --> 00:01:40,840 Peter Tatchell has devoted his life 14 00:01:40,920 --> 00:01:43,000 to crusading for homosexuals. 15 00:01:43,600 --> 00:01:45,720 [Peter] When people in power won't show compassion, 16 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:47,880 sometimes you have to up the ante. 17 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:51,200 He writes the book on how to do a protest. 18 00:01:51,280 --> 00:01:52,800 Peter is a performance artist. 19 00:01:52,880 --> 00:01:56,920 I am trying to ensure the arrest of a torturer. 20 00:01:57,000 --> 00:01:59,840 He deserves recognition for his extraordinary contribution 21 00:01:59,920 --> 00:02:02,480 to the happiness of millions who've never heard of him. 22 00:02:02,560 --> 00:02:04,560 The whole gay community owes you 23 00:02:04,640 --> 00:02:06,880 because of your bravery and your courage. 24 00:02:06,960 --> 00:02:09,280 Gay activist Peter Tatchell refused to move on. 25 00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:11,360 - Leave. - No, we are not moving away. 26 00:02:11,440 --> 00:02:15,000 Does Peter have an ego? Yes, you need an ego to perform. 27 00:02:15,080 --> 00:02:17,160 - Can you shut up now, please? - I'm not going to shut up. 28 00:02:17,240 --> 00:02:19,040 This is not a fair and open debate. 29 00:02:19,120 --> 00:02:22,040 This is the most disliked man in Britain. 30 00:02:23,600 --> 00:02:26,200 From the early days, I thought Peter was a brave motherfucker. 31 00:02:26,280 --> 00:02:28,560 Let me be frank, I don't think Peter was always helping. 32 00:02:28,640 --> 00:02:30,760 Let me finish. Let me finish. Let me finish. 33 00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:31,760 That really isn't true. 34 00:02:31,840 --> 00:02:34,320 The church for 2,000 years has been saying we're sick 35 00:02:34,400 --> 00:02:37,040 and sinful and immoral, and we're going to burn in hell. 36 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:38,360 The Archbishop of Canterbury 37 00:02:38,440 --> 00:02:40,440 was interrupted today by a gay rights protest. 38 00:02:40,520 --> 00:02:44,320 Dr Carey opposes lesbian and gay human rights. 39 00:02:44,400 --> 00:02:47,520 He's a bullying kind of chap trying to get his own way. 40 00:02:47,600 --> 00:02:50,720 Real men don't get insecure about gay men. 41 00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:53,920 Real men can cope and don't get scared by gay men. 42 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:56,840 Hey, Peter Tatchell, I'll see you again, you pussy. 43 00:02:56,920 --> 00:03:00,920 What keeps me going is the knowledge that the homophobes 44 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:03,200 who are against me want me to give up. 45 00:03:03,280 --> 00:03:05,800 Just like the Suffragettes or the black civil rights movement 46 00:03:05,880 --> 00:03:09,200 in America, we have to get a bit angry and confrontational. 47 00:03:09,280 --> 00:03:12,160 We've tried to play by the rules. It hasn't worked. 48 00:03:12,240 --> 00:03:14,080 Now we're going to break the rules. 49 00:03:30,120 --> 00:03:31,080 [song begins] 50 00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:34,280 ♪ Did you alter the face of the city? ♪ 51 00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:37,480 ♪ Make any change in the world you found ♪ 52 00:03:37,560 --> 00:03:40,840 ♪ Or did you observe all the warnings? ♪ 53 00:03:40,920 --> 00:03:44,000 ♪ Did you stand there in the traces 54 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:45,920 ♪ And let 'em feed you lies? ♪ 55 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:48,000 ♪ Did you trail along behind them ♪ 56 00:03:48,080 --> 00:03:50,240 ♪ Wearing blinkers on your eyes? ♪ 57 00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:52,520 ♪ Did you kiss the foot that kicked you? ♪ 58 00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:54,160 ♪ Did you thank them for their scorn? ♪ 59 00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:56,080 ♪ Did you ask for their forgiveness ♪ 60 00:03:56,160 --> 00:03:58,280 ♪ For the act of being born? ♪ 61 00:03:58,360 --> 00:04:02,520 ♪ Act of being born Act of being born ♪ 62 00:04:04,080 --> 00:04:05,960 [Background conversations] 63 00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:09,400 [Producer] Cameras running. 64 00:04:09,480 --> 00:04:11,080 Do you mind doing a hand clap 65 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:13,120 just in-between the two mics for me, just...? 66 00:04:13,200 --> 00:04:14,880 Yep, that's perfect, thank you. 67 00:04:17,120 --> 00:04:18,519 OK, we're ready. 68 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:22,240 [Ian] 1952, Melbourne. 69 00:04:22,320 --> 00:04:27,600 My family were working-class Pentecostal Evangelicals. 70 00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:28,680 Ooh, lovely. 71 00:04:28,760 --> 00:04:31,640 Pretty close to fundamentalist Christians. 72 00:04:31,720 --> 00:04:35,680 God has manifested his purpose. 73 00:04:35,760 --> 00:04:38,560 It was a very puritanical form of religion, 74 00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:42,320 which put great store on the terrible sins 75 00:04:42,400 --> 00:04:45,880 of wearing lipstick, drinking, smoking, swearing. 76 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:47,280 In the day in which we live, 77 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:50,080 where debauchery seems to be the norm, 78 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:54,240 where people are looking for sin and iniquity to abound... 79 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:57,400 In those days, they used to scream and shout and carry on. 80 00:04:57,480 --> 00:05:01,640 There is forgiveness for sin, though your sins be as scarlet. 81 00:05:01,720 --> 00:05:04,800 It was all fire and brimstone and "You're going to hell", 82 00:05:04,880 --> 00:05:08,080 and I look at my brother, Peter, and I think, yeah, 83 00:05:08,160 --> 00:05:09,960 he's more Christlike than 84 00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:12,680 so many of these religious...please. 85 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:19,160 It's a fight against the devil, really. 86 00:05:19,240 --> 00:05:20,160 That's... 87 00:05:20,240 --> 00:05:22,880 Well, that's what evil is, of course, isn't it? 88 00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:25,800 It's the devil in people. 89 00:05:25,880 --> 00:05:30,360 My name is Mari, and I'm Peter's mother. 90 00:05:30,440 --> 00:05:33,960 Unfortunately, she's been brainwashed by the church 91 00:05:34,040 --> 00:05:37,760 to think homosexuals are going to hell. 92 00:05:37,840 --> 00:05:40,000 I mean, good deeds don't save us. 93 00:05:40,080 --> 00:05:42,480 That's one thing that the Bible does teach. 94 00:05:42,560 --> 00:05:45,640 Good deeds are not going to get us to heaven. 95 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:50,160 This is my mother in 1946, aged 18. 96 00:05:54,160 --> 00:05:56,000 [Peter] All throughout my childhood, 97 00:05:56,080 --> 00:05:59,480 my mother suffered from life-threatening asthma. 98 00:05:59,560 --> 00:06:02,440 I basically had to look after 99 00:06:02,520 --> 00:06:05,600 my younger half-brother and two half-sisters. 100 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:08,680 He was like my second mum. 101 00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:12,800 He would just do things for me like get a bottle and 102 00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:15,920 put my shoes on, pick out the clothes he'd like me to wear. 103 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:17,440 [She chuckles] 104 00:06:23,680 --> 00:06:25,880 Send the next one through, next one through! 105 00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:36,120 I was regarded as a rebel at school. 106 00:06:36,200 --> 00:06:37,880 [School bell rings] 107 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:42,120 They didn't always agree with my politics. 108 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:45,320 I thought people should have input 109 00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:47,640 into the way the school was run. 110 00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:53,120 We ensured that the system of appointing house captains 111 00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:55,400 and prefects was made by the pupils, 112 00:06:55,480 --> 00:06:57,600 not the staff and the headmaster. 113 00:07:02,520 --> 00:07:06,680 This was grassroots democracy in the classroom. 114 00:07:12,960 --> 00:07:15,120 A lot of the boys used to joke that I was gay. 115 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:17,480 At the time, I didn't realise I was gay. 116 00:07:17,560 --> 00:07:19,400 I thought I was straight. I had girlfriends. 117 00:07:19,480 --> 00:07:21,880 It was quite a thing to be voted head boy, 118 00:07:21,960 --> 00:07:23,720 given that I was very radical left-wing, 119 00:07:23,800 --> 00:07:25,960 and, according to some guys, gay. 120 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:30,680 When my mother remarried... 121 00:07:30,760 --> 00:07:32,720 - Did she divorce? - Yeah, yeah. 122 00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:34,280 That must've been a shock to the church. 123 00:07:34,360 --> 00:07:36,200 - It was. - Oh... 124 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:39,080 My stepfather, Edwin, 125 00:07:39,160 --> 00:07:43,560 he was an extremely harsh and even cruel, I'd say... 126 00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:44,800 Member of the church? 127 00:07:44,880 --> 00:07:46,200 Yeah, but not very Christian 128 00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:49,920 in his own behaviour towards my mother or myself. 129 00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:53,960 His belief was that, quote, children should pay their way, 130 00:07:54,040 --> 00:08:00,040 so, with great reluctance, I left school at the end of 1968. 131 00:08:05,120 --> 00:08:07,640 Then, when I went to work in a department store, 132 00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:12,880 I met for the first time openly gay people about my own age 133 00:08:12,960 --> 00:08:16,800 who were, you know, handsome, creative, talented. 134 00:08:19,040 --> 00:08:21,160 Up until that time, I always thought a gay man 135 00:08:21,240 --> 00:08:24,080 was some dirty old geezer who molested young boys. 136 00:08:24,160 --> 00:08:25,680 I never conceived of the idea 137 00:08:25,760 --> 00:08:27,480 that a gay person could be someone like me. 138 00:08:33,799 --> 00:08:36,480 One of my co-workers used to invite me home 139 00:08:36,559 --> 00:08:39,679 for dinner every night as a joke, sort of. 140 00:08:40,760 --> 00:08:44,159 One night, when he asked me, I said yes. 141 00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:47,640 He had a little bedsit flat overlooking Port Phillip Bay, 142 00:08:47,720 --> 00:08:51,040 we had a very romantic dinner at the window, 143 00:08:51,120 --> 00:08:53,520 looking at the dolphins diving in and out of the water, 144 00:08:53,600 --> 00:08:55,920 and then, afterwards, we had sex, 145 00:08:56,000 --> 00:08:58,400 and it was a great experience, 146 00:08:58,480 --> 00:09:01,680 and I remember lying back on the bed and thinking to myself, 147 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:04,280 "If this is what gay is, then I'm definitely gay." 148 00:09:08,960 --> 00:09:13,120 My parents were such zealous Christians 149 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:15,840 that I initially dared not tell them I was gay. 150 00:09:16,880 --> 00:09:20,080 I feared they might report me to the police. 151 00:09:20,960 --> 00:09:22,320 [TV theme music] 152 00:09:22,400 --> 00:09:25,120 Please welcome Mardi Nitscke. 153 00:09:27,280 --> 00:09:29,480 Peter says that, over a period of two to three years, 154 00:09:29,560 --> 00:09:32,120 he was hinting towards the effect that he was homosexual. 155 00:09:32,200 --> 00:09:34,680 Like any other mother, you know, 156 00:09:34,760 --> 00:09:39,400 you hope that your son or your daughter is not homosexual. 157 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:42,040 What did being homosexual mean to you? 158 00:09:42,720 --> 00:09:46,480 Well, for one thing, it's against my Christian beliefs. 159 00:09:46,560 --> 00:09:49,680 Was it still a crime, though, in Australia when you came out? 160 00:09:49,760 --> 00:09:52,520 At that time, homosexuality was still punishable 161 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:54,480 by several years imprisonment... - Goodness. 162 00:09:54,560 --> 00:09:57,560 And possible forcible psychiatric treatment, as well. 163 00:10:01,840 --> 00:10:04,120 Where did your sense of injustice 164 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:06,440 and the possibility of putting it right come from? 165 00:10:06,520 --> 00:10:07,840 When I was aged 11. 166 00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:10,800 I heard about the bombing by white racists 167 00:10:10,880 --> 00:10:13,560 of a black church in Birmingham, Alabama. 168 00:10:16,640 --> 00:10:21,000 Four young girls, about my own age, were murdered. 169 00:10:21,080 --> 00:10:24,560 I remember thinking to myself, "How could anyone 170 00:10:24,640 --> 00:10:27,600 "kill four young girls in church on a Sunday morning?" 171 00:10:30,200 --> 00:10:33,040 That prompted my interest and support 172 00:10:33,120 --> 00:10:35,240 for the black civil rights movement. 173 00:10:35,320 --> 00:10:36,520 We need an organisation 174 00:10:36,600 --> 00:10:38,240 that's ready and willing to take action. 175 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:47,560 Later, I adapted their ideals, values and methods 176 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:50,120 to my own human rights work. 177 00:10:50,200 --> 00:10:53,920 Any kind of action, not when the men downtown see fit 178 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:57,920 but when we see fit, by any means necessary. 179 00:10:58,000 --> 00:11:00,720 I looked at the experience of the black civil rights movement, 180 00:11:00,800 --> 00:11:04,280 and calculated that it would probably take about 50 years 181 00:11:04,360 --> 00:11:07,160 to win LGBT+ rights 182 00:11:07,240 --> 00:11:11,160 in countries like Australia, the United States and Britain. 183 00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:20,640 From the age of 15 onwards, I began campaigning 184 00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:23,520 against Australia and America's involvement in the Vietnam War. 185 00:11:24,760 --> 00:11:27,880 Our goal was to build a huge protest 186 00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:30,440 that would show the Australian government 187 00:11:30,520 --> 00:11:33,280 that they no longer had the support of the people. 188 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:36,840 This barrel will continue to hold 189 00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:39,560 the immediate future for all young Australians 190 00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:41,640 to recruit training before they're drafted 191 00:11:41,720 --> 00:11:45,280 to regular army unit to complete their two-year service. 192 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:48,920 My name's Helen Hill. 193 00:11:49,000 --> 00:11:52,600 I met Peter at one of the regular demonstrations 194 00:11:52,680 --> 00:11:55,320 held at the General Post Office. 195 00:11:57,120 --> 00:12:01,920 Peter was one of the keen members to urge young men 196 00:12:02,000 --> 00:12:06,200 of a particular age group not to register for national service. 197 00:12:07,800 --> 00:12:10,600 That was a serious criminal offence 198 00:12:10,680 --> 00:12:14,400 tantamount to incitement, sedition and mutiny. 199 00:12:21,920 --> 00:12:23,400 [Helen] There was a demonstration 200 00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:26,480 outside the US Embassy on the 4th of July 201 00:12:26,560 --> 00:12:29,440 against the continuation of the Vietnam War. 202 00:12:30,480 --> 00:12:34,400 When we got there, the road was blockaded by mounted police. 203 00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:36,960 We sat down, and then we were subjected 204 00:12:37,040 --> 00:12:40,760 to a very violent mounted horseback charge with batons. 205 00:12:46,400 --> 00:12:48,480 I was very, very afraid. 206 00:12:51,240 --> 00:12:53,400 People's heads were being smashed and split. 207 00:12:59,560 --> 00:13:01,680 Once they saw police horses 208 00:13:01,760 --> 00:13:04,560 driving into the crowd, they would run away. 209 00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:06,760 But then there were others, 210 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:10,280 such as Peter, who would maintain their position. 211 00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:18,040 Did you like the idea of being the rebel? 212 00:13:18,120 --> 00:13:20,080 Well, I felt a satisfaction 213 00:13:20,160 --> 00:13:23,200 that I was doing what I believed to be right. 214 00:13:25,160 --> 00:13:29,440 The Vietnam Moratorium protests of 1970 215 00:13:29,520 --> 00:13:33,760 were the turning point of public opinion against the war. 216 00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:38,520 Ironic, isn't it, 217 00:13:38,600 --> 00:13:40,600 that, if you want to demonstrate for peace, 218 00:13:40,680 --> 00:13:41,600 you also have to employ 219 00:13:41,680 --> 00:13:43,560 some of the traditional qualities of war. 220 00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:49,320 It taught me how you can mobilise people. 221 00:13:51,560 --> 00:13:52,800 Get media coverage. 222 00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:56,120 Put people in power under pressure, 223 00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:58,360 and persuade public opinion to change. 224 00:14:03,440 --> 00:14:06,000 When did you leave Australia? 225 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:08,800 I left in 1971. 226 00:14:08,880 --> 00:14:13,200 If I'd stayed in Australia, I would've been required by law 227 00:14:13,280 --> 00:14:15,440 to register for the draft for Vietnam. 228 00:14:16,240 --> 00:14:19,680 And I had a conscious objection to that war. 229 00:14:19,760 --> 00:14:22,640 I believed it was immoral, unjust. 230 00:14:22,720 --> 00:14:24,040 I didn't want to be a part of it. 231 00:14:32,440 --> 00:14:36,120 [Gentle music] 232 00:14:47,480 --> 00:14:49,920 [Groovy music] 233 00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:52,440 Leaving Australia was quite a wrench. 234 00:14:52,520 --> 00:14:55,200 It was a leap in the dark. 235 00:14:55,280 --> 00:14:58,760 In the end, I settled in London, 236 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:01,040 got a good job, made lots of new friends. 237 00:15:01,120 --> 00:15:03,120 - And how old were you then? - Nineteen. 238 00:15:03,200 --> 00:15:07,080 So, still not legally able to have sex, 239 00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:08,880 even consenting sex, in the UK. 240 00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:09,920 Yeah. 241 00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:11,960 Still a crime. - You had to be 21, didn't you? 242 00:15:12,040 --> 00:15:13,000 Yeah. 243 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:15,920 When I'd first come to London and first met Peter Tatchell, 244 00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:17,520 if two men kissed in the street, 245 00:15:17,600 --> 00:15:20,920 it was an arrestable offence, it was an act of gross indecency. 246 00:15:21,000 --> 00:15:23,360 You could actually get a jail term for it. 247 00:15:24,080 --> 00:15:25,600 My name's Tom Robinson. 248 00:15:25,680 --> 00:15:27,960 I had a spell of fame in '78 249 00:15:28,040 --> 00:15:30,360 with a song called 'Sing if You're Glad to be Gay'. 250 00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:34,000 ♪ Sing if you're glad to be gay ♪ 251 00:15:34,080 --> 00:15:38,760 ♪ Sing if you're happy that way hey ♪ 252 00:15:38,840 --> 00:15:42,560 ♪ Sing if you're glad to be gay ♪ 253 00:15:42,640 --> 00:15:45,080 ♪ Sing if you're happy that way ♪ 254 00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:46,480 One more time. 255 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:51,400 London was an amazing place for a young queer man to arrive. 256 00:15:52,200 --> 00:15:55,200 The gay liberation movement had just kicked off. 257 00:15:57,760 --> 00:16:00,320 The second day I was here in London, 258 00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:02,440 I saw a sticker advertising 259 00:16:02,520 --> 00:16:04,920 the meetings of the newly formed Gay Liberation Front. 260 00:16:05,000 --> 00:16:07,520 - On your second day. - Yes, yes! 261 00:16:07,600 --> 00:16:08,640 - The second day. 262 00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:11,520 So, five days later, I was at my first meeting, 263 00:16:11,600 --> 00:16:13,760 and, a month later, I was helping to organise 264 00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:15,560 lots of the Gay Liberation Front's 265 00:16:15,640 --> 00:16:17,480 spectacular street protests. 266 00:16:17,560 --> 00:16:23,560 Ladies and gentlemen, you are looking at a roaring lesbian. 267 00:16:26,960 --> 00:16:32,680 I am one of those people, a pervert, according to society. 268 00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:37,600 [Angela] I remember Peter appeared from Australia, 269 00:16:37,680 --> 00:16:39,800 and he had lovely, dark, curly hair. 270 00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:42,640 We thought he was a rather lovely young man. 271 00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:46,600 My name's Angela Mason, 272 00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:50,280 and I've been involved in gay liberation movements 273 00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:52,720 for over 50 years. 274 00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:54,400 The Gay Liberation Front 275 00:16:54,480 --> 00:16:59,200 actually developed from what was happening in America. 276 00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:02,440 [Voiceover] In the summer of 1969, 277 00:17:02,520 --> 00:17:05,839 police violently raided the Stonewall Inn in New York City. 278 00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:07,960 Police raids on gay bars were common, 279 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:09,839 but, this time, the LGBTQ patrons 280 00:17:09,920 --> 00:17:12,920 and passers-by fought back, sparking days of rioting. 281 00:17:14,079 --> 00:17:17,079 In Stonewall, the riots are now so iconic 282 00:17:17,160 --> 00:17:19,319 that everyone assumes that we all knew about it 283 00:17:19,400 --> 00:17:20,440 when it was happening, 284 00:17:20,520 --> 00:17:23,000 and that immediately things sprang into action, 285 00:17:23,079 --> 00:17:25,000 but did you have a direct relationship 286 00:17:25,079 --> 00:17:27,200 with the Stonewall riots? 287 00:17:27,280 --> 00:17:30,520 I did hear about a subsequent protest 288 00:17:30,600 --> 00:17:34,720 two or three months later, a gay rights march in New York. 289 00:17:34,800 --> 00:17:36,840 And when I read that, 290 00:17:36,920 --> 00:17:41,640 I thought to myself, "Wow, this is what I want to be part of." 291 00:17:44,280 --> 00:17:46,680 [Rock'n'roll music] 292 00:17:48,040 --> 00:17:53,720 When we walked up 6th Avenue, and we said, "Join us," 293 00:17:53,800 --> 00:17:57,480 we didn't know that the world would join us and be proud. 294 00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:02,200 [Bells ring] 295 00:18:06,360 --> 00:18:08,720 The next meeting is January. 296 00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:11,680 The following meeting will be at the LSC as usual. 297 00:18:12,320 --> 00:18:14,240 The Gay Liberation Front developed 298 00:18:14,320 --> 00:18:17,400 from hundreds and hundreds of people coming together. 299 00:18:22,920 --> 00:18:25,880 Peter was always part of the events that were going on. 300 00:18:25,960 --> 00:18:27,520 The Gay Liberation Front 301 00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:33,520 was a completely joyful, fun, anarchic, radical experience. 302 00:18:35,320 --> 00:18:37,240 There was humour involved in it. 303 00:18:37,320 --> 00:18:38,960 We're here, we're queer, get used to it, 304 00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:41,000 rather than - would you please accept us? 305 00:18:43,440 --> 00:18:46,600 A lot of the politics of gay liberation 306 00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:49,240 weren't, in a sense, traditional politics. 307 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:54,640 They were challenging in quite a witty way cultural stereotypes. 308 00:18:55,600 --> 00:19:00,400 Personally, it means to me a liberation of my own life. 309 00:19:00,480 --> 00:19:03,280 Before GLF, I was incredibly... 310 00:19:03,360 --> 00:19:05,280 I was really leading a double life. 311 00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:08,880 The great thing about the Gay Liberation Front 312 00:19:08,960 --> 00:19:11,720 was that it provided you with alternative role models. 313 00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:17,520 Culturally, there were really only camp gay men visible, 314 00:19:17,600 --> 00:19:21,080 and no lesbians that I can recall. 315 00:19:21,160 --> 00:19:24,520 You'd get people like Kenneth Williams being very, very funny. 316 00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:26,760 It raises the problem of sex. 317 00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:28,440 I assure you, matron, 318 00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:31,000 I wouldn't dream of bothering you in that way. 319 00:19:31,080 --> 00:19:33,120 John Inman in 'Are You Being Served?' 320 00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:35,560 I bet you met a lot of nice girls that way. 321 00:19:35,640 --> 00:19:37,120 I did. 322 00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:39,760 Not to mention a roving reporter, a trendy bishop, 323 00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:41,600 a stringvestite and a dustman 324 00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:43,720 with a very interesting tale to tell. 325 00:19:44,640 --> 00:19:46,320 When I was 20, 326 00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:48,640 it was the first time I came across the word 327 00:19:48,720 --> 00:19:50,880 'homosexual' in a book, 328 00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:55,280 and therefore I was unable to form any meaningful 329 00:19:55,360 --> 00:19:59,480 emotional relationship of a kind which I longed for. 330 00:19:59,560 --> 00:20:03,720 I was unable to talk to anybody about what I felt 331 00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:05,720 because I was ashamed of it. 332 00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:10,320 The predominant view was that gay was sad and shameful. 333 00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:14,240 So, we wanted to develop an idea to counter that. 334 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:21,000 We organised the UK's first ever gay pride parade in July 1972. 335 00:20:28,560 --> 00:20:30,920 [Gentle piano music] 336 00:20:31,480 --> 00:20:35,560 Even many LGBT+ people felt it was a bad idea, 337 00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:38,280 drawing unnecessary attention to us. 338 00:20:51,120 --> 00:20:55,440 I never saw the LGBT+ freedom struggle 339 00:20:55,520 --> 00:20:57,040 as purely a national one. 340 00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:01,160 I always saw it as global. 341 00:21:01,560 --> 00:21:03,480 ♪ Please ♪ 342 00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:06,920 ♪ Do you believe in respect? ♪ 343 00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:11,400 ♪ To me ♪ 344 00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:14,080 Gay pride would be a way 345 00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:17,840 of helping overcome internalised homophobia. 346 00:21:22,960 --> 00:21:25,720 We would help change the consciousness 347 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:28,000 of the queer community. 348 00:21:32,520 --> 00:21:35,640 As well as asserting our dignity and rights 349 00:21:35,720 --> 00:21:37,520 before the straight majority. 350 00:21:41,200 --> 00:21:45,640 I've been on every single London pride parade since. 351 00:21:49,840 --> 00:21:54,000 We must never forget the rights of LGBT+ people 352 00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:57,320 in Africa, Asia, Latin America, and so, when I heard about 353 00:21:57,400 --> 00:21:59,800 the World Festival of Youth and Students being held 354 00:21:59,880 --> 00:22:04,160 in communist East Berlin in 1973, I thought this is a chance 355 00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:09,800 to take the gay liberation message to all these countries. 356 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:30,600 I was 21 at the time, 357 00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:33,760 and the idea of going to stage 358 00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:37,360 what turned out to be the first ever gay rights protest 359 00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:39,920 in a communist country, that was scary. 360 00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:42,120 There's a strength, people would call it bravery, 361 00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:43,520 wouldn't they, or foolhardiness. 362 00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:45,480 That's foolhardiness. 363 00:22:49,360 --> 00:22:52,120 [Dramatic music] 364 00:22:53,200 --> 00:22:54,720 Many people came up to me, 365 00:22:54,800 --> 00:22:56,880 and I secretly passed them leaflets 366 00:22:56,960 --> 00:22:58,640 I'd stuffed in my rucksack. 367 00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:07,400 Those leaflets went back to countries 368 00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:11,080 like Romania, Bulgaria, Hungary and Czechoslovakia. 369 00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:16,400 They were passed around in underground circles 370 00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:17,800 for years and years afterwards. 371 00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:26,200 That protest during the festival did prompt the beginnings 372 00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:31,400 of a new LGBT+ movement in those communist countries. 373 00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:40,200 I'm Stephen Fry. 374 00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:42,360 Like most people, I first heard of Peter Tatchell 375 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:45,800 because of the Bermondsey by-election. 376 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:51,680 The story really began locally 377 00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:55,120 when Bermondsey Labour Party first selected Peter Tatchell. 378 00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:59,560 Bermondsey lies south of Tower Bridge alongside the Thames. 379 00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:01,640 It has long been a Labour stronghold. 380 00:24:01,720 --> 00:24:03,160 We don't want someone there 381 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:05,240 who's gonna have their lips shut and say nothing, 382 00:24:05,320 --> 00:24:07,520 we want someone who's gonna fight hard for local people. 383 00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:09,640 You can guarantee I'm gonna do that, can't ya? 384 00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:11,680 Yeah. That's very nice. 385 00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:13,600 The fact that he was a gay candidate 386 00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:16,200 should've been something to be celebrated and admired, 387 00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:19,560 but it was made into a huge millstone around his neck. 388 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:21,280 Can I rely on your support for Labour? 389 00:24:21,360 --> 00:24:25,400 One way we went out of gay liberation was into public life. 390 00:24:26,120 --> 00:24:29,240 Lots of people who worked for local authorities 391 00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:30,880 became councillors. 392 00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:35,720 Peter saw the Labour Party as an opportunity 393 00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:39,680 to achieve major democratic socialist advance. 394 00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:42,280 It was a battle. 395 00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:44,720 A left-wing militant was picked last night 396 00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:46,520 to fight in the next election. 397 00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:48,320 I'm very confident that I will stop 398 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:50,560 the Tory rent increases, demand jobs for the unemployed, 399 00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:52,680 which everybody in the Labour Party agrees with. 400 00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:57,080 At the beginning of the election, 401 00:24:57,160 --> 00:24:58,800 he was well in front on the opinion polls. 402 00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:02,120 All these office blocks, who's putting a stop to them? Labour. 403 00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:04,040 I'm Chris Smith. 404 00:25:04,120 --> 00:25:06,800 I was the first openly gay cabinet minister 405 00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:07,840 anywhere in the world. 406 00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:09,440 Can I rely on your support for Labour 407 00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:10,600 in the election on the 24th? 408 00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:11,600 May do. 409 00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:14,320 During the run-up to the Bermondsey by-election, 410 00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:20,320 Peter was subject to all sorts of horrible viciousness. 411 00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:25,040 Peter Tatchell's homosexuality 412 00:25:25,120 --> 00:25:28,360 was ridiculed by his opponents and by some on his own side. 413 00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:33,920 ♪ Tatchell is a puppet as pretty as can be ♪ 414 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:37,200 ♪ But he must be slow if he don't know ♪ 415 00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:39,840 ♪ He can't beat our MP ♪ 416 00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:42,720 Tatchell is receiving constant death threats, 417 00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:44,440 and needs police protection. 418 00:25:44,520 --> 00:25:46,040 Two bullets sent to me. 419 00:25:46,120 --> 00:25:48,640 I had three attempts to run me down in the car. 420 00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:50,480 This letter here is pretty typical. 421 00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:52,840 At the age of 64 with a heart complaint, 422 00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:54,960 and therefore with little to lose, 423 00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:56,600 I will be prepared to go to prison 424 00:25:56,680 --> 00:25:58,160 for the murder of this creep. 425 00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:02,440 The dirtiest election campaign in British history. 426 00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:05,280 If you want to win an election, 427 00:26:05,360 --> 00:26:07,440 you don't run around with homosexuality as an issue. 428 00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:08,680 It's rubbish. 429 00:26:09,320 --> 00:26:12,080 The scale of hatred and violence 430 00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:15,640 seemed to coincide with the tabloid campaign. 431 00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:18,000 The real damage wasn't done 432 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:21,440 so much by any individual article as by the non-stop 433 00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:25,480 cumulative effect, the drip effect of week after week, 434 00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:27,600 month after month for 15 months, 435 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:30,760 a whole series of negative stories about myself. 436 00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:36,360 When we were going round the second time on the doorstep, 437 00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:37,440 people were saying, 438 00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:39,240 "Oh, I ain't gonna vote for that bloody queer." 439 00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:44,160 I'm not voting for Tatchell. That shit is not happening. 440 00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:46,240 - Ooh, careful, careful. - I mustn't swear. 441 00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:49,560 I can remember 442 00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:53,480 going round knocking on doors on election day in Bermondsey, 443 00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:55,600 and we had a list of people 444 00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:58,240 who were supposed to be Labour supporters, 445 00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:02,920 and we were knocking on doors trying to get them out to vote. 446 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:04,960 It was painfully obvious 447 00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:07,480 they were not going to vote for Peter. 448 00:27:07,560 --> 00:27:12,800 Lord David Edward Sutch, 97. 449 00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:14,960 [Cheering] 450 00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:18,920 Peter Tatchell... 451 00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:24,320 7,698. 452 00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:26,600 Liberal/SDP gain. 453 00:27:27,640 --> 00:27:29,440 Simon Hughes has been elected 454 00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:33,600 as member of parliament for Bermondsey. 455 00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:36,160 And here he is making his victory speech. 456 00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:38,040 [Voiceover] Tatchell thrashed. 457 00:27:38,120 --> 00:27:41,080 Disaster for Labour as Alliance win Bermondsey. 458 00:27:41,160 --> 00:27:42,440 As far as I know, 459 00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:46,040 it has beaten any swing in this century's political history. 460 00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:49,960 The defeated Peter Tatchell's expression this morning 461 00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:52,000 belied his bitterness at what he insists 462 00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:54,400 has been a smear campaign against him. 463 00:27:55,680 --> 00:28:01,080 Peter's defeat at Bermondsey, it was clearly... 464 00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:04,160 you couldn't just join the Labour Party, become an MP 465 00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:09,240 and thereby establish lesbian and gay rights. 466 00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:11,000 That wasn't an easy route, 467 00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:13,720 a route that we were going to be able to go through. 468 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:17,600 The great tragedy of this election is that prejudice 469 00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:22,040 and bigotry triumphed over tolerance and compassion, 470 00:28:22,120 --> 00:28:26,760 and that smears and lies triumphed over truth and reason. 471 00:28:26,840 --> 00:28:29,640 I could imagine a lot of people saw what happened to Peter 472 00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:32,320 over the by-election, and thought 473 00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:34,440 they would retreat straight back into the closet. 474 00:28:36,800 --> 00:28:38,440 The homophobia of that campaign 475 00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:41,720 did make me resolve to devote more energy 476 00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:44,360 to fighting for gay rights so that no other person 477 00:28:44,440 --> 00:28:46,880 would have to go through what I went through. 478 00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:49,480 Do you think it was better on the whole 479 00:28:49,560 --> 00:28:51,560 you didn't get elected as an MP? 480 00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:54,240 A social movement outside of parliament 481 00:28:54,320 --> 00:28:57,320 is often the real vehicle and mode of change. 482 00:28:57,400 --> 00:29:02,840 Grassroots movements have been the originators of social change 483 00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:06,560 which parliamentarians have later put into practice. 484 00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:08,640 ♪ One two three four ♪ 485 00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:20,120 [Thatcher] Where there is discord, may we bring harmony. 486 00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:23,400 Where there is error, may we bring truth. 487 00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:26,680 Where there is doubt, may we bring faith. 488 00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:34,440 The 1980s were a horrendous period for the LGBT+ community. 489 00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:37,760 Government was at war with us. 490 00:29:37,840 --> 00:29:40,920 Margaret Thatcher emphasised 491 00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:44,440 a very heterosexist normative sexual morality. 492 00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:50,040 The first articles appeared in newspapers 493 00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:53,160 about this extraordinary new bathhouse virus. 494 00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:59,400 At the outset, it was known as the gay plague. 495 00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:01,720 A Moral Majority report 496 00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:04,680 depicts what is supposed to be a typical American family. 497 00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:06,600 They're wearing surgical masks. 498 00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:07,840 The magazine charges 499 00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:11,080 the American family is now threatened by the AIDS epidemic. 500 00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:15,480 It seemed that the world was doing nothing about it, 501 00:30:15,560 --> 00:30:20,240 that...and that discrimination was being allowed. 502 00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:24,320 I hesitate to use the word perversion, 503 00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:26,720 but let's face up to the truth of this situation. 504 00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:28,000 That's what it is. 505 00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:31,960 Calls for gay people to be refused service 506 00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:33,640 in bars and restaurants. 507 00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:36,000 A gay person shared a drink with you. 508 00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:37,840 That could've been a death sentence. 509 00:30:38,440 --> 00:30:40,760 Even demands that we be quarantined 510 00:30:40,840 --> 00:30:42,360 as a threat to the public health. 511 00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:46,320 There might be a flea or a mosquito that bites them, 512 00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:49,000 takes their blood and then bites you and puts it in you. 513 00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:51,960 These people are...they are worse than lepers, 514 00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:55,360 and aside from the disgusting things they do, 515 00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:57,920 look at the threat they pose to everybody. 516 00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:01,520 75% of all victims are male homosexuals, 517 00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:03,600 and most of the others are intravenous drug users, 518 00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:05,640 and doctors don't know why. 519 00:31:05,720 --> 00:31:08,760 It was like living through a war. 520 00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:16,520 Outside of a battlefield, young men don't die in such numbers. 521 00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:24,280 [Poignant stringed music] 522 00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:33,480 People I knew were dying, and there was no hope. 523 00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:40,880 With AIDS, death was inevitable. 524 00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:42,920 There was no cure, absolutely none, 525 00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:44,960 and didn't look as if there was gonna be one. 526 00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:53,320 Well, to be told that is pretty hard, and we need champions, 527 00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:56,320 and who should step up but Peter Tatchell? 528 00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:01,480 Our guest tonight makes no secret of the fact 529 00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:02,880 that he's a homosexual. 530 00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:05,120 Does anyone want to come in and ask questions about that? 531 00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:06,360 Yes. 532 00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:08,920 Do you think people in general would be more tolerant of gays 533 00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:10,560 if there was a cure for AIDS? 534 00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:13,360 Well, first of all, we have to get rid of the idea 535 00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:15,880 that AIDS is a gay disease, it's not. 536 00:32:15,960 --> 00:32:19,160 AIDS is, I feel, is a consequence of sin. 537 00:32:19,240 --> 00:32:21,280 Man has strayed from Biblical truths. 538 00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:24,520 Jesus never said a word about homosexuality, 539 00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:27,480 and lots of people claim to speak on behalf of Jesus, 540 00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:29,680 but Jesus never, ever said a word 541 00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:31,280 against lesbians or gay men. 542 00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:33,920 [Peter] I was aghast 543 00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:37,400 at the way in which people with HIV were being demonised. 544 00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:41,360 We decided to organise a candlelit vigil 545 00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:44,680 outside the World Health Minister's Summit on AIDS 546 00:32:44,760 --> 00:32:46,120 in London. 547 00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:49,000 [Stephen] I had imagined it would be a cluster of people 548 00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:50,880 with torches and candlelights. 549 00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:54,040 It was huge. 550 00:32:54,120 --> 00:32:56,120 It was the largest demonstration I'd ever been in, 551 00:32:56,200 --> 00:32:58,400 and people were in tears because of the solidarity shown, 552 00:32:58,480 --> 00:32:59,800 because of the connection shown, 553 00:32:59,880 --> 00:33:01,680 because of the sudden understanding 554 00:33:01,760 --> 00:33:05,080 that we had each other, we really did have each other. 555 00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:11,840 [Poignant music] 556 00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:22,840 This was a period of deep, deep crisis, 557 00:33:22,920 --> 00:33:26,000 and yet it brought out a tremendous spirit 558 00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:30,160 of belonging and determination to be accepted. 559 00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:42,240 This put the human rights of people with HIV on the agenda 560 00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:45,080 in a way that hadn't happened before, 561 00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:48,320 and did result in the World Health Ministers 562 00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:52,960 issuing a declaration against discrimination in favour of 563 00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:56,640 education and support for people living with the virus. 564 00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:04,280 Peter's activism was one of the ingredients 565 00:34:04,360 --> 00:34:07,280 that led to a better response. 566 00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:10,040 The government is now seriously worried about AIDS, 567 00:34:10,120 --> 00:34:12,480 hence the making and formal release today 568 00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:13,840 of their new TV commercial. 569 00:34:15,199 --> 00:34:20,239 At first, only gays and IV drug users were being killed by AIDS, 570 00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:24,280 but now we know every one of us could be devastated by it. 571 00:34:27,639 --> 00:34:32,639 This was a period of real, intense homophobia, 572 00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:37,880 which culminated, of course, in Margaret Thatcher's 1987 speech 573 00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:39,719 at the Conservative Party Conference 574 00:34:39,800 --> 00:34:42,239 where she attacked the right to be gay. 575 00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:44,360 Children who need to be taught to respect 576 00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:46,760 traditional moral values 577 00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:50,719 are being taught that they have an inalienable right to be gay. 578 00:34:57,160 --> 00:35:00,320 And then introduced Section 28. 579 00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:01,640 The government is to ban 580 00:35:01,720 --> 00:35:04,360 the promotion of homosexuality in schools. 581 00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:08,520 Any espousal or promotion of gay life, 582 00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:13,840 any normalising of the gay existence, is prohibited. 583 00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:20,360 It has been adopted in modified form by countries like Russia, 584 00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:23,000 who now ban what they call 585 00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:26,000 the promotion of non-traditional sexual relations, 586 00:35:26,080 --> 00:35:29,040 sexual relations between people of the same gender. 587 00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:35,880 Thatcher made legislation 588 00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:41,000 whereby homosexuality could not be taught in schools 589 00:35:41,080 --> 00:35:44,080 or shown in any kind of positive light at all. 590 00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:49,560 But then unintended consequences of her doing that 591 00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:51,600 actually galvanised our community. 592 00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:53,760 It brought women and men together. 593 00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:55,600 Lesbians and gay men who'd been, kind of, 594 00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:58,440 drifting apart all the way through went, 595 00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:00,280 "No, we'll stand together on this," 596 00:36:00,360 --> 00:36:02,680 and fantastic solidarity emerged, 597 00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:05,120 and we got the Stonewall movement off the back of that, 598 00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:07,320 and we got the OutRage! movement off the back of that. 599 00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:10,320 [Chanting] 600 00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:13,040 [Peter] OutRage! wanted to change the system. 601 00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:18,440 Our goal was to secure respect, dignity and rights 602 00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:19,480 for queer people. 603 00:36:19,560 --> 00:36:23,680 Repealing anti-LGBT+ laws, 604 00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:26,160 changing the way in which institutions like the police 605 00:36:26,240 --> 00:36:28,080 and judiciary operated. 606 00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:29,720 This was an agenda 607 00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:34,200 for a fundamental transformation of British society. 608 00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:35,960 ♪ We're here because we're queer ♪ 609 00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:39,720 ♪ Because we're here because we're queer ♪ 610 00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:42,440 Like every successful social movement in history, 611 00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:46,200 we also believed there was a role for direct action 612 00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:47,840 and non-violent civil disobedience. 613 00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:54,480 OutRage! allowed a group of young men in the main, 614 00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:57,600 who were just incredibly angry 615 00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:00,320 about the way they were being treated, 616 00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:03,520 Peter allowed that to be expressed. 617 00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:06,680 We're queer, we're here and Soho's ours. 618 00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:11,520 Protestors say it's a discriminatory and outdated law, 619 00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:14,960 which turns Britain's estimated 5 million gays and lesbians 620 00:37:15,040 --> 00:37:16,640 into second-class citizens. 621 00:37:16,720 --> 00:37:18,720 We're gonna draw attention to the government 622 00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:20,880 the fact that Britain has more anti-gay laws 623 00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:23,080 than any other West European country. 624 00:37:23,160 --> 00:37:24,880 I spent the first couple of years, 625 00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:28,240 young years in the army, yeah, with my arse against the wall. 626 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:29,480 I didn't want to be buggered. 627 00:37:29,560 --> 00:37:32,120 I didn't want these people coming nowhere near me. 628 00:37:32,200 --> 00:37:36,880 The ban on lesbians and gay men serving in the armed forces 629 00:37:36,960 --> 00:37:41,280 is hypocritical when some of its most famous military commanders 630 00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:43,000 have been homosexual. 631 00:37:44,080 --> 00:37:47,600 I regarded him, I have to say, from time to time 632 00:37:47,680 --> 00:37:51,920 as a little bit of an irritant, but that was a good thing. 633 00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:55,680 We give public recognition to love that we feel for each other 634 00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:58,400 and the commitment we freely make to each other. 635 00:38:02,120 --> 00:38:06,040 Civil marriage in this country was a right we have fought for. 636 00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:09,240 We are now fighting for the right of our relationship 637 00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:12,480 to be recognised by the state. 638 00:38:13,480 --> 00:38:16,160 They wouldn't let us get married! 639 00:38:16,240 --> 00:38:17,640 [Jeering] 640 00:38:17,720 --> 00:38:20,920 Different people at different stages of their lives 641 00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:25,120 did want to contribute and fight and struggle in different ways. 642 00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:27,800 We got together, and decided to form 643 00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:32,600 a new lesbian and gay group, Stonewall, to work with 644 00:38:32,680 --> 00:38:35,920 political parties, and political and legal institutions. 645 00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:37,280 OutRage! would do 646 00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:39,520 the provocative, confrontational things, 647 00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:41,320 then Stonewall would step in and say, well, 648 00:38:41,400 --> 00:38:42,680 "Come and talk to us, 649 00:38:42,760 --> 00:38:44,880 "then you have to talk to those nasty OutRage! people." 650 00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:46,400 We were talking about 651 00:38:46,480 --> 00:38:48,840 different ways of achieving the same thing. 652 00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:50,240 When Stonewall went in to talk 653 00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:52,360 to cabinet ministers and prime ministers, 654 00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:54,760 there was a fear from the establishment 655 00:38:54,840 --> 00:38:57,680 that Tatchell and his troops would be erecting the barricades 656 00:38:57,760 --> 00:39:00,240 and Stonewall was behind there, having a cup of tea. 657 00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:02,920 What do we want? Equality! 658 00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:05,920 At the same time, there was a whole litany 659 00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:10,240 of really aggravating police activities. 660 00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:12,720 The toilet at Victoria Station is one of the many places 661 00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:16,600 where police are arresting men for sexual offences. 662 00:39:16,680 --> 00:39:19,320 Excuse me, sir? Police officers, you're under arrest. 663 00:39:19,400 --> 00:39:23,640 Police officers would dress up as hunky, gay men, 664 00:39:23,720 --> 00:39:29,160 and would try and entice people into kissing and fondling them, 665 00:39:29,240 --> 00:39:31,320 and would then promptly arrest them. 666 00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:35,720 The Metropolitan Police are mounting an agent provocateur, 667 00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:38,520 an entrapment operation against gay men. 668 00:39:38,600 --> 00:39:41,000 Escalating arrests of gay and bisexual men. 669 00:39:41,080 --> 00:39:42,800 What they are doing is illegal 670 00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:45,200 and contrary to the Home Office guidelines. 671 00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:49,440 Rising levels of queer-bashing violence, and even murder. 672 00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:52,920 Murders of gay men are notoriously difficult to solve, 673 00:39:53,000 --> 00:39:54,680 which means that, in many cases, 674 00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:57,640 the killers are still at large, and could strike again. 675 00:39:57,720 --> 00:40:00,920 [Crowd] Arrest the murderers, not the victims! 676 00:40:02,160 --> 00:40:06,240 The police were persecuting us, not protecting us. 677 00:40:09,320 --> 00:40:13,040 If you think homosexuality is legal in Britain, you're wrong. 678 00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:17,400 A pretty good party. Dancing, music, socialising. 679 00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:20,120 But, by introducing those two men to each other, 680 00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:21,920 he's just committed a crime. 681 00:40:24,360 --> 00:40:25,320 Could all those people 682 00:40:25,400 --> 00:40:27,400 who are gonna be handing themselves to the police 683 00:40:27,480 --> 00:40:30,320 stand just outside the main entrance to the police station? 684 00:40:30,720 --> 00:40:32,280 My favourite involvement with OutRage! 685 00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:36,680 was the kissing, actually kissing on camera. 686 00:40:40,160 --> 00:40:41,720 This man gave me his telephone number 687 00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:43,440 so that I could get in touch with him, 688 00:40:43,520 --> 00:40:45,280 and we could have a sexual liaison. 689 00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:46,920 That is illegal in this country, 690 00:40:47,000 --> 00:40:49,000 and that is a disgrace, and, if they want me, 691 00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:51,600 take me now in front of the whole fucking world. 692 00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:54,240 We're handing ourselves in as sex criminals. 693 00:40:54,320 --> 00:40:56,240 [Loud cheering] 694 00:41:03,640 --> 00:41:06,680 No more, no more, no more, no more, 695 00:41:06,760 --> 00:41:08,760 no more, no more, no more, no more! 696 00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:11,400 Peter has a genius for picking up things 697 00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:13,680 that are gonna create a headline. 698 00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:17,720 [Peter] It empowered LGBT+ people 699 00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:21,840 to believe that they didn't have to be victims anymore. 700 00:41:23,800 --> 00:41:28,760 We could take on powerful institutions and laws, 701 00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:30,360 and defeat them. 702 00:41:34,040 --> 00:41:37,640 It also made straight people aware 703 00:41:37,720 --> 00:41:40,160 of the scale of discrimination that we faced, 704 00:41:40,240 --> 00:41:42,920 and the level of hate crime and violence. 705 00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:46,200 In interviews, he's so, so earnest and deadpan 706 00:41:46,280 --> 00:41:48,960 in the way that he talks about serious issues, 707 00:41:49,040 --> 00:41:51,640 you don't realise that lurking behind that 708 00:41:51,720 --> 00:41:56,000 is also somebody who enjoys a bit of wildness and anarchism. 709 00:41:57,960 --> 00:42:00,000 From the beginning of OutRage! 710 00:42:00,080 --> 00:42:02,680 through to the mid-1990s, public opinion 711 00:42:02,760 --> 00:42:08,160 began to dramatically shift in favour of LGBT+ equality. 712 00:42:08,880 --> 00:42:11,440 Shame, shame! 713 00:42:13,920 --> 00:42:17,440 I did sometimes feel antagonistic to Peter, 714 00:42:17,520 --> 00:42:19,360 and didn't agree with him. 715 00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:21,600 Occasionally, I may have even thought 716 00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:23,560 he was on a bit of an ego trip, you know? 717 00:42:26,400 --> 00:42:28,040 Well, you're a leading member of OutRage!, 718 00:42:28,120 --> 00:42:29,600 and this is the militant gay group 719 00:42:29,680 --> 00:42:33,160 which seeks to expose and to out gay people in high places 720 00:42:33,240 --> 00:42:35,480 who'd prefer to keep their sexuality private. 721 00:42:35,560 --> 00:42:36,840 This is you in action. 722 00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:41,320 [Ethereal music] 723 00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:49,120 We tried to speak with the church, 724 00:42:49,200 --> 00:42:52,120 we tried to be reasonable, and they would not listen. 725 00:42:52,200 --> 00:42:53,760 They refused to meet with us. 726 00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:55,560 They refused to have any dialogue, 727 00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:57,120 so, in those circumstances, 728 00:42:57,200 --> 00:42:59,680 we felt that we had to adopt more confrontational tactics. 729 00:42:59,760 --> 00:43:00,960 Until last week, 730 00:43:01,040 --> 00:43:03,280 the Bishop of London's sex life was his own business. 731 00:43:03,360 --> 00:43:05,160 Then, the Right Reverend David Hope 732 00:43:05,240 --> 00:43:08,400 suddenly found himself having to discuss his sexual nature 733 00:43:08,480 --> 00:43:10,000 in every newspaper in the land, 734 00:43:10,080 --> 00:43:13,280 all because he'd been sent a letter from this man 735 00:43:13,360 --> 00:43:17,080 urging him to come out as homosexual. 736 00:43:17,160 --> 00:43:19,960 What business is it of yours what he does? 737 00:43:20,040 --> 00:43:22,600 Outing people was not popular with everybody, 738 00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:25,680 including some gay people who were themselves out, 739 00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:28,040 'cause they could remember the time they hadn't been out, 740 00:43:28,120 --> 00:43:29,520 and the difficulties of that, 741 00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:32,480 and to declare that someone is gay affects not just them 742 00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:35,160 but their relationships with their family and so on. 743 00:43:35,240 --> 00:43:38,000 But you took the view that outing certain people 744 00:43:38,080 --> 00:43:43,360 under certain circumstances was the right thing to do. 745 00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:47,080 Outing, for me, is queer self-defence. 746 00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:50,720 We never outed anyone because they were gay in the closet. 747 00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:53,560 It's only because they were being hypocritical 748 00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:57,360 and colluding with homophobic laws and values. 749 00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:02,960 [George] The outings, there were ten bishops involved. 750 00:44:03,040 --> 00:44:04,680 I knew them all personally, 751 00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:06,960 and I think it hurt them very deeply. 752 00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:08,960 I'm George Carey. 753 00:44:09,040 --> 00:44:14,960 I was Archbishop of Canterbury from 1991 to 2002. 754 00:44:15,040 --> 00:44:19,920 Peter was pretty active in the human rights agenda. 755 00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:22,800 I thought he was a bullying kind of chap 756 00:44:22,880 --> 00:44:25,960 trying to get his own way, and I didn't like that. 757 00:44:26,040 --> 00:44:28,760 Dr Hope is one of the most senior of the Anglican bishops. 758 00:44:28,840 --> 00:44:30,360 No-one at this level in the church 759 00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:33,560 has spoken out so explicitly about his sexuality before. 760 00:44:33,640 --> 00:44:36,640 David took it in a very remarkable way. 761 00:44:36,720 --> 00:44:40,400 He called journalists around, and he said, 762 00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:43,960 "I want to tell you my sexuality is grey." 763 00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:50,680 Some may choose to describe themselves as being homosexual, 764 00:44:50,760 --> 00:44:52,400 some as heterosexual. 765 00:44:53,360 --> 00:44:56,040 For some, the area is slightly greyer, 766 00:44:56,120 --> 00:44:58,120 and I think I was saying 767 00:44:58,200 --> 00:45:01,840 that that's the sort of area I find myself in. 768 00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:06,320 I never agreed with forcibly outing people. 769 00:45:06,400 --> 00:45:09,080 I could absolutely see the temptation, 770 00:45:09,160 --> 00:45:12,680 especially where there was hypocrisy going on. 771 00:45:12,760 --> 00:45:17,440 People who were campaigning for Section 28, 772 00:45:17,520 --> 00:45:20,920 who were campaigning against an equal age of consent, 773 00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:24,480 who were voting through homophobic legislation, 774 00:45:24,560 --> 00:45:30,280 and yet most of us knew that they themselves were gay. 775 00:45:30,360 --> 00:45:34,520 It's deplorable when people issue homophobic remarks, 776 00:45:34,600 --> 00:45:37,000 and actually make life worse 777 00:45:37,080 --> 00:45:41,720 for their queer sisters and brothers 778 00:45:41,800 --> 00:45:44,520 while being gay themselves. 779 00:45:44,600 --> 00:45:47,680 That's reprehensible, 780 00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:50,320 but I still don't think it gives you the moral high ground 781 00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:53,680 to actually get out there and condemn them or tear them 782 00:45:53,760 --> 00:45:55,840 kicking and screaming out of the closet. 783 00:45:55,920 --> 00:45:58,280 This bishop had done nothing 784 00:45:58,360 --> 00:46:01,960 to merit this letter and this public exposure in the end. 785 00:46:02,040 --> 00:46:04,400 Well, it's a bit much for the church to talk about intrusions. 786 00:46:04,480 --> 00:46:07,120 I mean, the church for 2,000 years has been intruding 787 00:46:07,200 --> 00:46:10,040 on the lives of lesbian and gay people, saying we're sick 788 00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:12,880 and sinful and immoral, and we're going to burn in hell. 789 00:46:12,960 --> 00:46:14,960 And here we have the outrageous outer of them all, 790 00:46:15,040 --> 00:46:15,960 Peter Tatchell. 791 00:46:16,040 --> 00:46:18,160 Do you not think you're kind of being a bit hypocritical 792 00:46:18,240 --> 00:46:19,440 by actually outing these people, 793 00:46:19,520 --> 00:46:21,840 and then they've gone on to suffer that same discrimination 794 00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:23,760 that the people that you're trying to protect are? 795 00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:25,720 You seem to me to be shooting yourself in the foot. 796 00:46:25,800 --> 00:46:27,240 You should not do this, man. 797 00:46:27,320 --> 00:46:29,480 What you want is a form of fascism. 798 00:46:29,560 --> 00:46:30,840 Well, the press... 799 00:46:30,920 --> 00:46:33,480 You can't just wreck people's lives and everything. 800 00:46:33,560 --> 00:46:34,880 Whose lives have been wrecked? 801 00:46:34,960 --> 00:46:35,880 How do you know that? 802 00:46:35,960 --> 00:46:38,040 It's the old ends justified the means argument. 803 00:46:38,120 --> 00:46:39,640 No, I'm not saying we'd do anything. 804 00:46:39,720 --> 00:46:41,120 [George] It was wrong to do. 805 00:46:41,200 --> 00:46:45,080 It was wrong to do because some of these people were very old. 806 00:46:45,160 --> 00:46:50,120 One or two were married and living faithful married lives. 807 00:46:50,200 --> 00:46:51,760 You heard some rumour, you had... 808 00:46:51,840 --> 00:46:53,960 It's not rumour. It's not rumour. 809 00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:56,000 Do you have kind of secret policemen 810 00:46:56,080 --> 00:46:58,440 who go around, sort of, taking photographs? 811 00:46:58,520 --> 00:46:59,920 No, we don't. 812 00:47:00,000 --> 00:47:02,080 It's a kind of gay Gestapo, really, isn't it? 813 00:47:02,160 --> 00:47:05,040 Everybody knows that, high up in the church, 814 00:47:05,120 --> 00:47:07,280 there are lesbian and gay people. 815 00:47:07,360 --> 00:47:11,240 How can you in all conscious act as the judge and jury 816 00:47:11,320 --> 00:47:12,440 in these matters, 817 00:47:12,520 --> 00:47:15,160 and how dare you define a man by his sexuality. 818 00:47:15,240 --> 00:47:17,640 What he decides is basically to bomb his way to the 819 00:47:17,720 --> 00:47:20,040 negotiating table, and release a few names of some bishops. 820 00:47:20,120 --> 00:47:22,000 That is repugnant behaviour. 821 00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:25,160 Society continues to be more homophobic because of people 822 00:47:25,240 --> 00:47:28,800 like you, Mr Tatchell, and your outrageous tactics. 823 00:47:28,880 --> 00:47:32,440 This charge of counterproductive tactics 824 00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:34,680 has always been used, you know, 825 00:47:34,760 --> 00:47:37,320 against every rising social movement. 826 00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:40,200 It was used against the Suffragettes in Britain. 827 00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:42,760 It was used against the black civil rights movement 828 00:47:42,840 --> 00:47:44,160 in the United States. 829 00:47:44,240 --> 00:47:46,760 Most historians accept that the catharsis 830 00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:50,520 of those direct-action protests was the necessary spark 831 00:47:50,600 --> 00:47:52,560 to generate public awareness 832 00:47:52,640 --> 00:47:54,680 about the scale of discrimination, 833 00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:56,680 and to build momentum for change. 834 00:48:01,120 --> 00:48:03,360 Whatever the critics may say, 835 00:48:03,440 --> 00:48:06,720 the outing campaign was incredibly effective. 836 00:48:06,800 --> 00:48:08,640 As far as I know, 837 00:48:08,720 --> 00:48:13,560 none of those bishops ever again said anything anti-gay. 838 00:48:13,640 --> 00:48:16,200 52 years of civil disobedience, Peter. 839 00:48:16,280 --> 00:48:17,760 53 now. 840 00:48:17,840 --> 00:48:19,360 53 years, I beg your pardon. 841 00:48:19,440 --> 00:48:23,520 Do you remember Easter Sunday 1988? 842 00:48:23,600 --> 00:48:24,840 1998. 843 00:48:25,800 --> 00:48:28,360 The Archbishop of Canterbury's traditional Easter sermon 844 00:48:28,440 --> 00:48:31,160 was interrupted today by a gay rights protest. 845 00:48:31,240 --> 00:48:33,080 Demonstrators scaled the pulpit, 846 00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:35,480 waving banners and shouting at the archbishop. 847 00:48:35,560 --> 00:48:38,360 Lord, You call us all to be men and women of peace. 848 00:48:38,440 --> 00:48:40,280 We had tried for eight years 849 00:48:40,360 --> 00:48:42,960 to get a meeting with the archbishop. 850 00:48:43,040 --> 00:48:45,880 He was saying that there should be no legal recognition 851 00:48:45,960 --> 00:48:47,400 of same-sex relationships. 852 00:48:47,480 --> 00:48:49,360 We were faced with the option, 853 00:48:49,440 --> 00:48:52,960 either give up and walk away or go on to challenge him, 854 00:48:53,040 --> 00:48:57,080 and where better than in his own cathedral 855 00:48:57,160 --> 00:48:59,760 at Canterbury on Easter Sunday 856 00:48:59,840 --> 00:49:03,520 when his sermon had been televised around the world? 857 00:49:05,080 --> 00:49:07,840 My name's Adrian Arbib. I'm a journalist. 858 00:49:07,920 --> 00:49:11,480 We were told to be at Canterbury Cathedral, 859 00:49:11,560 --> 00:49:14,840 to be as close to the front as possible for the Easter sermon. 860 00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:23,280 And we were told just to, you know, be ready with a camera. 861 00:49:23,360 --> 00:49:26,800 So, I went in with a little film camera. 862 00:49:30,960 --> 00:49:33,520 Remember how He told you 863 00:49:33,600 --> 00:49:37,280 while He was with you in Galilee, and then... 864 00:49:37,360 --> 00:49:40,320 Suddenly, these people rushed into the pulpit. 865 00:49:40,400 --> 00:49:41,560 Peter was there. 866 00:49:41,640 --> 00:49:43,240 I was pushed to one side, 867 00:49:43,320 --> 00:49:48,440 and he bellowed into the microphone for some minutes. 868 00:49:48,520 --> 00:49:52,920 Dr Carey supports discrimination against lesbian and gay people. 869 00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:56,280 He opposes lesbian and gay human rights. 870 00:49:56,360 --> 00:49:59,560 This is not a Christian teaching. 871 00:49:59,640 --> 00:50:03,240 I just leapt up and sort of got as close as I could. 872 00:50:03,320 --> 00:50:08,760 I was trapped in the pulpit. There was a stunned silence. 873 00:50:08,840 --> 00:50:11,520 The congregation start clapping, and they were going, 874 00:50:11,600 --> 00:50:14,760 "Out, out, out," which I thought was hilarious. 875 00:50:16,400 --> 00:50:19,320 And then the officials started to come and pull people off. 876 00:50:19,400 --> 00:50:21,320 Peter's shouting, of course, it echoes 877 00:50:21,400 --> 00:50:24,360 throughout the whole cathedral, which is, like, epic. 878 00:50:24,440 --> 00:50:26,600 It is wrong for Dr Carey 879 00:50:26,680 --> 00:50:30,600 to say that people who are lesbian and gay 880 00:50:30,680 --> 00:50:32,840 should be discriminated against at work. 881 00:50:32,920 --> 00:50:34,200 They were quite violent. 882 00:50:34,280 --> 00:50:36,240 They weren't kind of being gentle about it. 883 00:50:36,320 --> 00:50:38,600 As they were being pulled off the pulpit, 884 00:50:38,680 --> 00:50:40,160 they were punching Peter's hands. 885 00:50:40,240 --> 00:50:42,160 Peter was actually trying to hang onto the pulpit, 886 00:50:42,240 --> 00:50:44,920 and they were actually punching, you know, really hard. 887 00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:48,400 I ask you, I beseech you. 888 00:50:48,480 --> 00:50:50,400 About a good three or four minutes, 889 00:50:50,480 --> 00:50:52,080 so it was a really effective protest 890 00:50:52,160 --> 00:50:53,640 'cause it made front page. 891 00:50:53,720 --> 00:50:55,880 The media love all that kind of stuff. 892 00:50:58,000 --> 00:51:00,280 [Shouting] 893 00:51:00,360 --> 00:51:02,880 My reaction at the time was anger 894 00:51:02,960 --> 00:51:07,600 mixed with some degree of sadness about it. 895 00:51:07,680 --> 00:51:10,800 Why does he do this? 896 00:51:10,880 --> 00:51:14,200 It's a kind of scorched earth policy, you know? 897 00:51:14,280 --> 00:51:16,120 You don't make friends that way. 898 00:51:16,200 --> 00:51:17,920 Storm into the pulpit, 899 00:51:18,000 --> 00:51:22,360 get your own way, bellow and then retreat, you know? 900 00:51:22,440 --> 00:51:26,920 Where is the justification for this? 901 00:51:31,360 --> 00:51:33,240 As far as I'm concerned, it doesn't damage me, 902 00:51:33,320 --> 00:51:35,840 but I'm worried when it hurts other people, 903 00:51:35,920 --> 00:51:38,920 and disrupts a Christian service, 904 00:51:39,000 --> 00:51:40,280 as they did this morning. 905 00:51:40,360 --> 00:51:43,400 Peter Tatchell was completely unapologetic in court. 906 00:51:43,480 --> 00:51:45,360 He said there was a moral obligation 907 00:51:45,440 --> 00:51:47,800 to stand up against human rights abuses. 908 00:51:47,880 --> 00:51:51,280 We put the issue of the church's homophobia on the public agenda. 909 00:51:51,360 --> 00:51:53,160 Most of the letters, though, were hostile. 910 00:51:53,240 --> 00:51:54,400 That's the problem. 911 00:51:54,480 --> 00:51:57,400 Perhaps too many people watching saw what I saw. 912 00:51:57,480 --> 00:51:59,680 Oh, here goes Peter Tatchell again, 913 00:51:59,760 --> 00:52:02,240 rather than listening to what you had to say. 914 00:52:02,320 --> 00:52:05,600 Well, I was a member of the unsuspecting congregation, 915 00:52:05,680 --> 00:52:07,640 and I was appalled and I was embarrassed. 916 00:52:07,720 --> 00:52:10,120 My elderly mother and my homophobic older brother 917 00:52:10,200 --> 00:52:12,000 were shocked and disgusted, 918 00:52:12,080 --> 00:52:15,280 and then to have this going on in front of me was, I thought, 919 00:52:15,360 --> 00:52:17,360 entirely counter-productive to the wider course. 920 00:52:17,440 --> 00:52:20,160 You think maintaining the decorum of a church service 921 00:52:20,240 --> 00:52:23,120 is more important than dealing with people 922 00:52:23,200 --> 00:52:25,120 who violate lesbian and gay human rights. 923 00:52:25,200 --> 00:52:27,640 I think you chose your target completely incorrectly. 924 00:52:27,720 --> 00:52:29,640 I know what works and what doesn't. 925 00:52:29,720 --> 00:52:32,360 I don't know that you do know what works. 926 00:52:32,440 --> 00:52:34,120 On this particular case... 927 00:52:34,200 --> 00:52:36,560 I think you're dogmatic and I think you're arrogant. 928 00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:40,760 I think it was a mistake on Peter's part. 929 00:52:40,840 --> 00:52:42,920 Does it worry you, being disliked? 930 00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:46,000 I'd much rather be loved and appreciated, 931 00:52:46,080 --> 00:52:49,880 and, also, it's quite painful when all the good things 932 00:52:49,960 --> 00:52:52,400 that I've achieved in the past get totally ignored. 933 00:52:52,480 --> 00:52:54,840 We all make missteps and nobody's an angel. 934 00:52:54,920 --> 00:52:57,680 I'm not saying Peter's perfect or he's the ideal activist. 935 00:52:57,760 --> 00:53:00,360 Sometimes you agree with him, sometimes you disagree with him. 936 00:53:00,440 --> 00:53:04,200 The morality I ask for myself I give to others. 937 00:53:04,280 --> 00:53:07,080 If anybody wants to come to a gay pride event, 938 00:53:07,160 --> 00:53:09,400 which I hold as very important, and disrupt it... 939 00:53:09,480 --> 00:53:11,000 You wouldn't have them thrown out? 940 00:53:11,080 --> 00:53:12,600 No, of course not. 941 00:53:12,680 --> 00:53:13,800 Well, you should! 942 00:53:13,880 --> 00:53:15,240 I would defend their right to protest 943 00:53:15,320 --> 00:53:19,200 because protest is fundamental to the lifeblood of a democracy. 944 00:53:19,280 --> 00:53:21,920 Someone said that you were the most hated man in Britain. 945 00:53:22,000 --> 00:53:23,640 Public enemy number one, 946 00:53:23,720 --> 00:53:27,040 a gay fascist and even a homosexual terrorist. 947 00:53:28,280 --> 00:53:30,480 I wear these epithets with pride, 948 00:53:30,560 --> 00:53:34,040 but I've gotta say that it was very, very tough. 949 00:53:34,960 --> 00:53:36,320 Police constable Frost 950 00:53:36,400 --> 00:53:38,240 has brought the letter back to the office. 951 00:53:38,320 --> 00:53:40,360 Peter Tatchell, you are a sick piece of shit. 952 00:53:40,440 --> 00:53:42,680 How can you speak with pride about being gay? 953 00:53:42,760 --> 00:53:45,440 Sticking or taking another man's prick up the arse 954 00:53:45,520 --> 00:53:46,520 is not natural. 955 00:53:46,600 --> 00:53:48,240 Why do you think God made women? 956 00:53:48,320 --> 00:53:50,880 I wouldn't want to overreact to the letter. 957 00:53:50,960 --> 00:53:52,320 No. 958 00:53:52,400 --> 00:53:54,080 You're an outcast. You should be gassed. 959 00:53:54,160 --> 00:53:57,120 Gays are only slightly more acceptable than Pakis. 960 00:53:57,200 --> 00:53:58,560 Die soon, you cunt. 961 00:53:58,640 --> 00:54:00,920 So, not only homophobic, 962 00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:02,840 but a bit of racism thrown in for good measure. 963 00:54:02,920 --> 00:54:07,320 At the time, I was vilified for campaigns 964 00:54:07,400 --> 00:54:09,840 like an equal age of consent, 965 00:54:09,920 --> 00:54:13,240 and for LGBT+ inclusive education in schools. 966 00:54:13,320 --> 00:54:16,560 Peter Tatchell has stood outside a school 967 00:54:16,640 --> 00:54:19,160 handing out literature demonstrating in favour 968 00:54:19,240 --> 00:54:22,120 of they're being educated to make a choice. 969 00:54:22,200 --> 00:54:24,720 Read the literature. It's OK to be gay. 970 00:54:24,800 --> 00:54:26,560 You may be gay yourselves. 971 00:54:26,640 --> 00:54:29,480 With messages like 'How Do You Know Unless You've Tried It?' 972 00:54:29,560 --> 00:54:32,320 they handed out leaflets to children and parents. 973 00:54:32,400 --> 00:54:34,120 Is that your son? He may be gay. 974 00:54:34,200 --> 00:54:36,480 That information should be provided by teachers 975 00:54:36,560 --> 00:54:37,480 but it's not. 976 00:54:37,560 --> 00:54:41,560 I was denounced even by many people in the LGBT+ community. 977 00:54:41,640 --> 00:54:44,480 What I'm worried about is the effect, 978 00:54:44,560 --> 00:54:46,800 the long-term effect, that this sort of action will have. 979 00:54:46,880 --> 00:54:50,000 I think it's an angry mode of politics 980 00:54:50,080 --> 00:54:52,840 that verges on the self-righteous, 981 00:54:52,920 --> 00:54:58,560 and it's, and was meant to be highly provocative. 982 00:54:58,640 --> 00:55:02,040 There were people in Stonewall who didn't like Peter, 983 00:55:02,120 --> 00:55:06,480 and not everybody thought he always acted in the right way, 984 00:55:06,560 --> 00:55:08,240 but he wasn't really accountable. 985 00:55:08,320 --> 00:55:11,960 I think, for people who are intensely homophobic, 986 00:55:12,040 --> 00:55:14,600 I've come to personify 987 00:55:14,680 --> 00:55:18,560 everything they loathe and fear about homosexuality. 988 00:55:18,640 --> 00:55:20,440 I get bricks through the window, 989 00:55:20,520 --> 00:55:23,840 bullets through the door, arson attempts on my home. 990 00:55:23,920 --> 00:55:27,920 If I had to dwell on these attacks, 991 00:55:28,000 --> 00:55:30,520 if I thought about them, I'd probably go mad, 992 00:55:30,600 --> 00:55:31,760 I'd probably commit suicide. 993 00:55:31,840 --> 00:55:33,440 [Phone ringing] 994 00:55:33,520 --> 00:55:37,240 Hi, there. Fine, thank you. 995 00:55:37,640 --> 00:55:39,760 I think I'm quite difficult to live with 996 00:55:39,840 --> 00:55:42,880 because the pressure of my work is so relentless. 997 00:55:42,960 --> 00:55:45,640 Are you in central London at all on Monday? 998 00:55:45,720 --> 00:55:48,000 I work ridiculous hours. 999 00:55:48,080 --> 00:55:51,120 It's not uncommon for me to work a 16-hour day. 1000 00:55:51,200 --> 00:55:53,440 Half-past nine in the morning, oh! 1001 00:55:53,520 --> 00:55:55,680 I hardly have time to eat or sleep. 1002 00:55:57,680 --> 00:56:01,280 - Do you not miss having someone special in your life? 1003 00:56:01,360 --> 00:56:04,760 - I've had five wonderful relationships in my life, 1004 00:56:04,840 --> 00:56:07,320 which is more than a lot of people. 1005 00:56:07,400 --> 00:56:10,920 I feel quite content. I'm single now. 1006 00:56:11,000 --> 00:56:13,040 Maybe I'll have another relationship in the future, 1007 00:56:13,120 --> 00:56:14,800 who knows? 1008 00:56:14,880 --> 00:56:16,960 Yeah, 'cause basically I need about seven copies 1009 00:56:17,040 --> 00:56:22,200 for all the major media outlets like BBC, ITN, Channel 4, Sky. 1010 00:56:22,280 --> 00:56:24,400 There was one public episode in your life 1011 00:56:24,480 --> 00:56:26,960 which proved rather popular for people who'd been your critics 1012 00:56:27,040 --> 00:56:28,240 up to that point, 1013 00:56:28,320 --> 00:56:31,840 the attempted citizen's arrest of Robert Mugabe. 1014 00:56:31,920 --> 00:56:35,000 Zimbabwean human rights defenders 1015 00:56:35,080 --> 00:56:38,120 asked if I would try and do something to raise 1016 00:56:38,200 --> 00:56:42,520 international awareness about the abuses of the Mugabe regime. 1017 00:56:42,600 --> 00:56:46,800 I hit on the idea of using the power of citizen's arrest 1018 00:56:46,880 --> 00:56:50,720 to try and get Mugabe put on trial for torture. 1019 00:56:51,160 --> 00:56:52,960 [Horns tooting] 1020 00:56:53,040 --> 00:56:55,240 - Stop him, he's under arrest! - He's under arrest! 1021 00:56:55,320 --> 00:56:57,360 - Arrest him! 1022 00:56:57,440 --> 00:56:59,920 The guy in the car! Arrest him! 1023 00:57:00,000 --> 00:57:01,920 [Stephen] Peter is a performance artist 1024 00:57:02,000 --> 00:57:03,920 with his politics to some extent. 1025 00:57:04,000 --> 00:57:06,680 He knows how to stage these things, and he knows perfectly 1026 00:57:06,760 --> 00:57:09,440 well that he's not going to be able to put handcuffs on him 1027 00:57:09,520 --> 00:57:13,240 and take him to a court of law in The Hague or anywhere else. 1028 00:57:13,320 --> 00:57:15,880 Arrest the torturer! No! 1029 00:57:15,960 --> 00:57:17,760 Arrest him! Arrest the torturer! 1030 00:57:17,840 --> 00:57:19,760 You are under arrest. 1031 00:57:19,840 --> 00:57:21,840 [Adrian] There's a lot of adrenaline flowing. 1032 00:57:21,920 --> 00:57:24,480 You can see beforehand he's sort of psyching himself up. 1033 00:57:24,560 --> 00:57:26,320 You can see him going through the process. 1034 00:57:26,400 --> 00:57:28,400 He's got all the arguments in his head. 1035 00:57:28,480 --> 00:57:31,760 I've asked you, officer, to arrest President Mugabe 1036 00:57:31,840 --> 00:57:37,680 under Section 134 of the Criminal Justice Act 1988. 1037 00:57:37,760 --> 00:57:41,960 Peter knows how to get the lighting director 1038 00:57:42,040 --> 00:57:44,240 to point the spotlight at the place he wants it pointed, 1039 00:57:44,320 --> 00:57:45,680 and that's a great skill. 1040 00:57:45,760 --> 00:57:47,640 I'm trying to prevent torture. 1041 00:57:47,720 --> 00:57:50,560 I am trying to ensure the arrest 1042 00:57:50,640 --> 00:57:52,480 of a torturer, Robert Mugabe. 1043 00:57:52,560 --> 00:57:57,080 I thought the attempt to arrest Mugabe on human rights charges 1044 00:57:57,160 --> 00:57:58,520 would help shine a spotlight 1045 00:57:58,600 --> 00:58:01,760 on the human rights abuses of his regime. 1046 00:58:05,680 --> 00:58:07,600 Open the gate! 1047 00:58:07,680 --> 00:58:10,240 [Yelling] 1048 00:58:13,880 --> 00:58:15,880 But he can be pretty difficult. 1049 00:58:15,960 --> 00:58:18,160 He can be a bit of a nightmare, actually. 1050 00:58:19,080 --> 00:58:20,560 It's tough, doing that kind of stuff. 1051 00:58:20,640 --> 00:58:24,000 It takes a lot of energy to do that. 1052 00:58:24,680 --> 00:58:26,120 I've come to see Tim Land. 1053 00:58:26,200 --> 00:58:28,560 I would be grateful if you would leave the building. 1054 00:58:28,640 --> 00:58:31,880 How many millions of people have to die in Zimbabwe 1055 00:58:31,960 --> 00:58:34,680 before you decide not to play cricket? 1056 00:58:34,760 --> 00:58:40,520 You know, is it 10,000? 100,000? 1 million? 5 million? 1057 00:58:40,600 --> 00:58:42,320 Would 5 million deaths be enough? 1058 00:58:42,400 --> 00:58:44,360 Listen. There are other issues. 1059 00:58:44,440 --> 00:58:46,000 [Peter] Bring me to the president. 1060 00:58:46,080 --> 00:58:47,760 Would someone help me, for God's sake? 1061 00:58:47,840 --> 00:58:50,840 And the media is a safeguard. I mean, it always has been. 1062 00:58:50,920 --> 00:58:56,240 In all the damage I've ever covered, Peter or otherwise, 1063 00:58:56,320 --> 00:58:59,640 if the media's not there, then people will get beaten up. 1064 00:58:59,720 --> 00:59:03,000 Peter Tatchell lurked in the lobby of a hotel 1065 00:59:03,080 --> 00:59:05,600 to ambush Mr Mugabe as he emerged from lunch. 1066 00:59:05,680 --> 00:59:07,480 President Mugabe. 1067 00:59:07,560 --> 00:59:10,880 I put you under arrest on charges of torture 1068 00:59:10,960 --> 00:59:13,360 under the United Nations Convention Against Torture. 1069 00:59:13,440 --> 00:59:17,320 Under international law, 1070 00:59:17,400 --> 00:59:20,000 President Mugabe, you are under arrest. 1071 00:59:20,080 --> 00:59:22,480 [High-pitched bell ringing] 1072 00:59:30,520 --> 00:59:33,400 [High-pitched warbling noises] 1073 00:59:51,240 --> 00:59:54,960 - Who do you work for? - What? 1074 00:59:55,040 --> 00:59:56,560 - Who do you work for? - Who do I work for? 1075 00:59:56,640 --> 00:59:58,520 - You hit him. - No! 1076 00:59:58,600 --> 01:00:00,240 Let me speak to him, who do you work for? 1077 01:00:04,480 --> 01:00:05,880 [Woman] Don't touch him. 1078 01:00:11,680 --> 01:00:13,280 Could somebody stand in front of the car 1079 01:00:13,360 --> 01:00:15,000 so they can't run him over? 1080 01:00:15,080 --> 01:00:17,280 [Tyres screeching] 1081 01:00:19,520 --> 01:00:21,480 I thought, even from the early days, 1082 01:00:21,560 --> 01:00:23,240 that Peter was a brave motherfucker, 1083 01:00:23,320 --> 01:00:26,160 but when I saw him being beaten up by Robert Mugabe's thugs 1084 01:00:26,240 --> 01:00:29,240 on prime-time national television, 1085 01:00:29,320 --> 01:00:33,880 I thought, "He's a really brave motherfucker." 1086 01:00:33,960 --> 01:00:36,840 That was the moment 1087 01:00:36,920 --> 01:00:42,800 when Peter ceased to be a media pariah, 1088 01:00:42,880 --> 01:00:45,640 and became a national treasure. 1089 01:00:45,720 --> 01:00:47,360 Welcome him now, he's Peter Tatchell. 1090 01:00:47,440 --> 01:00:50,480 Welcome to the show, Peter. - Morning, Peter. 1091 01:00:50,560 --> 01:00:51,640 Let's have a closer look 1092 01:00:51,720 --> 01:00:54,040 at the incredible news footage of your latest confrontation. 1093 01:00:54,120 --> 01:00:56,920 I'm putting you under arrest on charges of torture... 1094 01:00:57,000 --> 01:01:01,080 The attempted arrest of Mugabe made me realise that 1095 01:01:01,160 --> 01:01:04,800 I could take on very powerful and quite threatening people. 1096 01:01:04,880 --> 01:01:06,280 Get your punk ass here, white boy. 1097 01:01:06,360 --> 01:01:09,520 Come here and tell me I fuck you in your ass, you punk white boy. 1098 01:01:09,600 --> 01:01:10,880 You faggot. 1099 01:01:10,960 --> 01:01:12,880 You can't touch me, you're not man enough. 1100 01:01:12,960 --> 01:01:14,960 I eat your asshole alive, you bitch. 1101 01:01:15,040 --> 01:01:16,960 Peter and Mike Tyson, there's a match-up. 1102 01:01:17,040 --> 01:01:19,080 I'll fuck you till you love me, faggot. 1103 01:01:19,160 --> 01:01:20,840 To confront people like that, again, 1104 01:01:20,920 --> 01:01:23,440 it's just brilliant on Peter's part. 1105 01:01:23,520 --> 01:01:25,680 I walked over to Tyson, 1106 01:01:25,760 --> 01:01:28,760 and I said to him, "Will you make a statement 1107 01:01:28,840 --> 01:01:31,680 that you oppose discrimination against gay people?" 1108 01:01:31,760 --> 01:01:35,720 To my surprise and delight, he was the first 1109 01:01:35,800 --> 01:01:40,480 major straight sport star to ever make such a statement. 1110 01:01:50,880 --> 01:01:51,880 [Stephen] Within Russia, 1111 01:01:51,960 --> 01:01:55,560 once society legally regards you as on the fringes of the law 1112 01:01:55,640 --> 01:01:57,240 because of your sexuality, 1113 01:01:57,320 --> 01:01:59,400 it means you are vulnerable to all kinds of attack. 1114 01:02:01,200 --> 01:02:03,160 It means blood on the pavements. 1115 01:02:03,240 --> 01:02:05,840 They're constantly likely to be beaten up 1116 01:02:05,920 --> 01:02:09,440 or blackmailed or silenced or fined or imprisoned. 1117 01:02:10,800 --> 01:02:15,480 In 2007, I was asked by Russian LGBT+ activists 1118 01:02:15,560 --> 01:02:17,960 to go to Moscow to support their efforts to hold 1119 01:02:18,040 --> 01:02:20,320 a gay pride parade, 1120 01:02:20,400 --> 01:02:24,280 which is lawful under the Russian Constitution, 1121 01:02:24,360 --> 01:02:27,640 but was banned by the then mayor of Moscow. 1122 01:02:27,720 --> 01:02:29,880 So, I went there to stand in solidarity 1123 01:02:29,960 --> 01:02:32,840 with these incredibly brave Russian activists. 1124 01:02:32,920 --> 01:02:34,760 The gay rights activist Peter Tatchell 1125 01:02:34,840 --> 01:02:38,040 and Right Said Fred singer Richard Fairbrass have been 1126 01:02:38,120 --> 01:02:40,480 attacked while they were taking part in a march in Moscow. 1127 01:02:40,560 --> 01:02:45,400 We were absolutely right to stage a short, peaceful protest, 1128 01:02:45,480 --> 01:02:47,360 and that's all we intended to do. 1129 01:02:57,240 --> 01:02:59,080 We'd literally been here two minutes. 1130 01:02:59,160 --> 01:03:01,280 Whoa! Whoa! 1131 01:03:03,680 --> 01:03:06,560 [Shouting and screaming] 1132 01:03:10,120 --> 01:03:15,160 I was targeted by neo-Nazis 1133 01:03:15,240 --> 01:03:17,600 with police collusion, 1134 01:03:17,680 --> 01:03:19,360 and very badly beaten. 1135 01:03:20,560 --> 01:03:22,600 Oh! 1136 01:03:23,240 --> 01:03:25,040 [Peter groaning] 1137 01:03:30,680 --> 01:03:32,360 Were you hurt as a result? 1138 01:03:32,440 --> 01:03:33,680 Um... 1139 01:03:37,360 --> 01:03:38,640 Um... 1140 01:03:41,920 --> 01:03:45,280 As a result of the many physical assaults I've endured, 1141 01:03:45,360 --> 01:03:47,160 I've been left with 1142 01:03:47,240 --> 01:03:50,200 semi-permanent brain and eye injuries. 1143 01:03:51,760 --> 01:03:55,360 It's damaged my concentration, memory, 1144 01:03:55,440 --> 01:03:58,280 balance and coordination. 1145 01:03:59,880 --> 01:04:03,080 It doesn't stop me but I am slower and it's more difficult. 1146 01:04:03,160 --> 01:04:05,560 I used to be a really good typist, 1147 01:04:05,640 --> 01:04:08,600 but now I find, really, it's a real struggle to type. 1148 01:04:08,680 --> 01:04:11,000 I get the letters jumbled up a lot. 1149 01:04:11,080 --> 01:04:14,560 But, you know, by comparison to human rights defenders 1150 01:04:14,640 --> 01:04:17,360 in Iran or Saudi Arabia, I've got off lightly. 1151 01:04:17,440 --> 01:04:19,120 You know, I haven't been imprisoned, 1152 01:04:19,200 --> 01:04:21,280 I haven't been tortured, I'm not dead, 1153 01:04:21,360 --> 01:04:25,920 so I count my blessings and think, well, carry on the fight. 1154 01:04:35,720 --> 01:04:40,840 This one is Stephen Fry and me, the actor Stephen Fry. 1155 01:04:40,920 --> 01:04:42,520 Oh, yeah. 1156 01:04:42,600 --> 01:04:44,880 Protesting in 2013 when the Russians introduced 1157 01:04:44,960 --> 01:04:46,640 a new anti-gay law 1158 01:04:46,720 --> 01:04:50,040 to criminalise what they call the propaganda 1159 01:04:50,120 --> 01:04:53,320 of non-traditional sexual relations, 1160 01:04:53,400 --> 01:04:54,640 in other words homosexuality. 1161 01:04:54,720 --> 01:04:55,760 Mm. 1162 01:04:56,880 --> 01:05:00,000 Lots of teachers have been sacked from their jobs, 1163 01:05:00,080 --> 01:05:02,440 which is obviously upsetting. 1164 01:05:05,600 --> 01:05:06,760 Well, you don't know 1165 01:05:06,840 --> 01:05:10,120 whether they're, sort of, preaching their... 1166 01:05:10,200 --> 01:05:11,520 What do you mean preaching? 1167 01:05:11,600 --> 01:05:14,640 You know, they'd say, "It's alright to be gay," you know? 1168 01:05:14,720 --> 01:05:16,040 What's wrong with saying that? 1169 01:05:16,120 --> 01:05:19,000 Lots of young kids will be gay and lesbians, 1170 01:05:19,080 --> 01:05:21,920 so they should be saying to kids it's OK to be gay. 1171 01:05:22,000 --> 01:05:24,720 Don't be upset or depressed or suicidal. 1172 01:05:26,040 --> 01:05:29,040 Yeah, but not coming from a teacher, 1173 01:05:29,120 --> 01:05:31,640 I don't think it's right, but anyway. 1174 01:05:31,720 --> 01:05:33,040 Well, isn't a teacher 1175 01:05:33,120 --> 01:05:35,760 supposed to prepare young people for adult life? 1176 01:05:38,200 --> 01:05:40,200 Mardi, your son is very vociferous 1177 01:05:40,280 --> 01:05:42,640 when it comes to gay rights and things. 1178 01:05:42,720 --> 01:05:45,760 Would you prefer that he was less so? 1179 01:05:48,120 --> 01:05:51,240 Well, in honesty, I would say yes. 1180 01:05:51,320 --> 01:05:56,160 It's really a very difficult life for a homosexual, 1181 01:05:56,240 --> 01:05:59,200 and I think he's suffered so much, 1182 01:05:59,280 --> 01:06:02,840 and his life would be less stressful. 1183 01:06:22,280 --> 01:06:24,440 [Peter] So, we're going out for a day's outing. 1184 01:06:24,520 --> 01:06:25,880 Where are we off to, Heather? 1185 01:06:25,960 --> 01:06:28,000 Copperlode Dam. 1186 01:06:28,080 --> 01:06:29,920 - You ever been there? - No. 1187 01:06:30,000 --> 01:06:31,200 What about you, Mum? 1188 01:06:31,280 --> 01:06:33,040 No, I've never been there, I'd love to go. 1189 01:06:33,120 --> 01:06:34,480 Yes, we're going. 1190 01:06:35,840 --> 01:06:37,160 My stepfather 1191 01:06:37,240 --> 01:06:41,320 was a pretty old-fashioned patriarchal authoritarian. 1192 01:06:41,400 --> 01:06:43,440 This is Edwin, is that his name? 1193 01:06:43,520 --> 01:06:44,760 Edwin, yeah. 1194 01:06:44,840 --> 01:06:47,040 He was physically violent towards me. 1195 01:06:47,120 --> 01:06:51,680 He'd fly into a rage, and go physically berserk. 1196 01:06:51,760 --> 01:06:54,880 I can remember times when he gave me the strap, 1197 01:06:54,960 --> 01:06:58,520 and the red welt marks would swell up and last for days. 1198 01:06:58,600 --> 01:07:00,440 Another time in a rage, 1199 01:07:00,520 --> 01:07:05,200 he broke a leg off a dining room chair to beat me with. 1200 01:07:05,280 --> 01:07:06,840 He swung at me with an axe. 1201 01:07:06,920 --> 01:07:10,840 If I hadn't ducked, he probably would've hit me in the head. 1202 01:07:10,920 --> 01:07:12,160 [Mardi] Oh... 1203 01:07:12,240 --> 01:07:17,600 I was really upset about the way that he treated Peter, yes. 1204 01:07:17,680 --> 01:07:22,240 He was a very aggressive man, and very... 1205 01:07:22,320 --> 01:07:28,080 Oh, he was brutal at times, really. 1206 01:07:28,160 --> 01:07:30,680 [Heather] I was very scared of my father. 1207 01:07:30,760 --> 01:07:35,240 I can remember Peter getting many, many, many bashings, 1208 01:07:35,320 --> 01:07:39,080 far worse than he would let on. 1209 01:07:41,960 --> 01:07:44,680 And your mother didn't intervene or...? 1210 01:07:44,760 --> 01:07:46,160 There were several occasions 1211 01:07:46,240 --> 01:07:48,840 when my stepfather was so violent and threatening 1212 01:07:48,920 --> 01:07:50,880 that my mother had to call the police. 1213 01:07:50,960 --> 01:07:54,440 They came and repeatedly warned him that he would be arrested. 1214 01:07:54,520 --> 01:07:56,320 In the end, he always calmed down 1215 01:07:56,400 --> 01:07:59,200 in front of the police, and got away with it. 1216 01:07:59,280 --> 01:08:03,400 It was so bad that I often said to my mother, you know, 1217 01:08:03,480 --> 01:08:05,760 "Can't we leave?" 1218 01:08:07,200 --> 01:08:09,600 [Heather] I still, to this day, 1219 01:08:09,680 --> 01:08:13,400 carry scars from how he treated my brothers. 1220 01:08:17,120 --> 01:08:19,120 It was a terrible time, 1221 01:08:19,200 --> 01:08:23,640 and I don't know why Peter's such a good person 1222 01:08:23,720 --> 01:08:27,760 because he could've quite easily gone the other way. 1223 01:08:27,840 --> 01:08:30,080 The experience of abuse from my stepfather 1224 01:08:30,160 --> 01:08:34,920 made me inclined to stand up to bullies, 1225 01:08:35,000 --> 01:08:39,279 to take on tyrants, to challenge people who are doing bad things. 1226 01:08:40,840 --> 01:08:43,120 [Fanfare] 1227 01:08:53,160 --> 01:08:55,279 [Newsreader] Vladimir Putin has signed a decree 1228 01:08:55,359 --> 01:08:58,680 banning so-called homosexual propaganda in Russia, 1229 01:08:58,760 --> 01:09:02,680 which effectively bans gay rights rallies, and could be 1230 01:09:02,760 --> 01:09:05,439 used to prosecute anyone voicing support for homosexuals. 1231 01:09:05,520 --> 01:09:10,000 [Stephen] Russia, so violently homophobic, 1232 01:09:10,080 --> 01:09:12,600 and the example of Chechnya, which is like a sort of bubble 1233 01:09:12,680 --> 01:09:14,720 inside Russia, I mean, 1234 01:09:14,800 --> 01:09:17,920 that is just unspeakable what's going on there. 1235 01:09:18,760 --> 01:09:21,760 [Newsreader] Here in Chechnya, Ramzan Kadyrov, 1236 01:09:21,840 --> 01:09:23,560 whose security forces are accused of 1237 01:09:23,640 --> 01:09:25,720 abduction and torture. 1238 01:09:25,800 --> 01:09:29,479 Really, really awful levels of homophobia, 1239 01:09:29,560 --> 01:09:31,880 and murder of gay people. 1240 01:09:31,960 --> 01:09:34,000 [Translation] Here, a man is a man, 1241 01:09:34,080 --> 01:09:38,399 a woman is a woman, an animal is an animal and a dog is a dog. 1242 01:09:43,439 --> 01:09:45,479 [Shouting] 1243 01:09:54,640 --> 01:09:57,000 [Newsreader] The Russian prime minister, Vladimir Putin, 1244 01:09:57,080 --> 01:09:59,560 has thanked soccer's world governing body, FIFA, 1245 01:09:59,640 --> 01:10:03,360 for choosing his country to host the 2018 World Cup. 1246 01:10:05,120 --> 01:10:07,960 Angry fighters like Peter 1247 01:10:08,040 --> 01:10:09,840 are as needed now as they ever have been. 1248 01:10:15,000 --> 01:10:19,560 We are honoured to be in this tough and fair fight. 1249 01:10:24,440 --> 01:10:26,040 [Peter] With the World Cup in June, 1250 01:10:26,120 --> 01:10:29,280 what can we do to help support the Russian activists? 1251 01:10:29,360 --> 01:10:31,320 Could I go there and do some kind of protest 1252 01:10:31,400 --> 01:10:34,600 to draw attention to what's happening in Russia? 1253 01:10:35,960 --> 01:10:38,680 We have Peter going very much into the lion's den. 1254 01:10:38,760 --> 01:10:40,760 He's off to Moscow to campaign. 1255 01:10:40,840 --> 01:10:44,040 So, my job is to get Peter to Moscow, 1256 01:10:44,120 --> 01:10:47,720 and to do everything that I can to keep him safe. 1257 01:10:48,800 --> 01:10:50,840 Kind of want him back, as well, in one piece. 1258 01:10:52,560 --> 01:10:54,120 Let's just go over safety. 1259 01:10:54,200 --> 01:10:59,000 The mobiles of all of us are in an emergency WhatsApp group. 1260 01:10:59,080 --> 01:11:02,840 Obviously, that's encrypted, including your emergency mobile. 1261 01:11:04,520 --> 01:11:05,600 Could I just caution 1262 01:11:05,680 --> 01:11:07,960 about contacting any of these Russian groups, 1263 01:11:08,040 --> 01:11:11,920 'cause they're gonna almost certainly be under surveillance 1264 01:11:12,000 --> 01:11:15,720 by the Russian security services so you make contact with them, 1265 01:11:15,800 --> 01:11:18,680 then they know that I'm there and where I am. 1266 01:11:18,760 --> 01:11:22,800 There are very few people know that you're going to Russia. 1267 01:11:22,880 --> 01:11:26,640 Match tickets in case you have to show immigration. 1268 01:11:26,720 --> 01:11:30,400 [Peter] I'm quite nervous. Russia is not a safe place. 1269 01:11:30,480 --> 01:11:35,400 It's a country where homophobia is the norm, 1270 01:11:35,480 --> 01:11:38,160 really excessive and often violent homophobia. 1271 01:11:38,240 --> 01:11:40,000 There's the dictation button. 1272 01:11:40,080 --> 01:11:43,800 How do I get to the Kremlin? 1273 01:11:45,040 --> 01:11:48,120 And then hit the button, that's it, and then go. 1274 01:11:49,120 --> 01:11:51,640 And then hit the little speaker button next to Russian. 1275 01:11:54,120 --> 01:11:55,520 Hm. 1276 01:12:00,680 --> 01:12:03,480 [Dramatic music] 1277 01:12:10,680 --> 01:12:16,320 Here's my England flag, which is sort of a decoy 1278 01:12:16,400 --> 01:12:20,640 to suggest that I am really a genuine English football fan. 1279 01:12:20,720 --> 01:12:25,160 This is my rainbow flag for Moscow, 1280 01:12:25,240 --> 01:12:28,400 which I hope to display at some point in Red Square. 1281 01:12:29,240 --> 01:12:33,800 Although I've done over 3,000 direct actions in my lifetime, 1282 01:12:33,880 --> 01:12:36,920 I'm still very, very nervous about this trip. 1283 01:12:37,000 --> 01:12:42,640 You know, I'm feeling a little bit physically ill, in fact. 1284 01:12:42,720 --> 01:12:45,720 [Interviewer] Have you been to see the doctor recently, 1285 01:12:45,800 --> 01:12:48,760 and do they know that you're going overseas to do a protest? 1286 01:12:48,840 --> 01:12:51,200 My doctors have said very clearly, 1287 01:12:51,280 --> 01:12:54,600 "No more head injuries, you've had enough." 1288 01:12:56,920 --> 01:12:58,840 And friends of mine are saying, 1289 01:12:58,920 --> 01:13:01,760 "This is really, really dangerous. 1290 01:13:01,840 --> 01:13:04,480 "You could end up dead." 1291 01:13:07,320 --> 01:13:10,320 [Dramatic music continues] 1292 01:13:17,800 --> 01:13:19,880 In the eyes of the Russian authorities, 1293 01:13:19,960 --> 01:13:21,800 I am a troublemaker. 1294 01:13:21,880 --> 01:13:23,560 My past protests in Russia 1295 01:13:23,640 --> 01:13:28,440 have been very bad PR for the Putin regime. 1296 01:13:28,520 --> 01:13:31,080 [People cheering] 1297 01:13:37,160 --> 01:13:39,720 [Peter] With all the world's media shining on Russia, 1298 01:13:39,800 --> 01:13:44,560 it would be a tragedy if the World Cup passed off 1299 01:13:44,640 --> 01:13:48,680 without anyone drawing attention to the human rights abuses 1300 01:13:48,760 --> 01:13:54,120 against LGBT people in Russia, and, in particular, in Chechnya. 1301 01:13:57,600 --> 01:13:59,280 There's been 15 or 20 countries over the years 1302 01:13:59,360 --> 01:14:03,040 that I've managed to evade their security checks. 1303 01:14:04,320 --> 01:14:07,120 What day does Red Square open again? Tomorrow? 1304 01:14:07,200 --> 01:14:08,680 After tomorrow. 1305 01:14:08,760 --> 01:14:11,720 After tomorrow? So, they're open on Thursday? 1306 01:14:15,280 --> 01:14:19,520 My news release has been sent out to the media, 1307 01:14:19,600 --> 01:14:22,240 calling out FIFA over giving Russia the World Cup, 1308 01:14:22,320 --> 01:14:27,520 and Russia over its abuse of LGBT human rights. 1309 01:14:41,840 --> 01:14:44,840 The one thing all tyrannies fear 1310 01:14:44,920 --> 01:14:48,240 is a media coverage of their human rights abuses. 1311 01:14:55,800 --> 01:15:00,320 Protest has such power because it gets media coverage 1312 01:15:00,400 --> 01:15:03,960 shining a spotlight on persecution. 1313 01:15:04,040 --> 01:15:07,440 They don't want the message to get out to the wider world 1314 01:15:07,520 --> 01:15:10,160 about what they're doing to their own people. 1315 01:15:21,760 --> 01:15:23,400 [Keys clacking] 1316 01:15:36,480 --> 01:15:38,280 [Peter sighs] 1317 01:15:38,360 --> 01:15:39,880 I'm just so fucking exhausted. 1318 01:15:39,960 --> 01:15:41,280 [Interviewer] I know you are. 1319 01:15:46,240 --> 01:15:49,280 [Whispering] This is my Brazil football shirt, 1320 01:15:49,360 --> 01:15:53,240 which I'm wearing in order to get through security 1321 01:15:53,320 --> 01:15:55,760 into the cordoned area around the Kremlin. 1322 01:15:57,280 --> 01:16:00,080 I've got several placards that I could use today, 1323 01:16:00,160 --> 01:16:02,160 but these are the two that I think. 1324 01:16:02,240 --> 01:16:05,960 It's either this one. - Mm-hm. 1325 01:16:06,040 --> 01:16:08,400 Or this one. 1326 01:16:15,400 --> 01:16:17,880 [Dramatic music] 1327 01:16:22,240 --> 01:16:25,720 [Reporter] The FIFA World Cup kicks off in Moscow tonight, 1328 01:16:25,800 --> 01:16:28,960 with the host nation, Russia, taking on Saudi Arabia. 1329 01:16:30,280 --> 01:16:32,960 I am a bit concerned that my email and phone 1330 01:16:33,040 --> 01:16:36,640 might be monitored by the Russian authorities, 1331 01:16:36,720 --> 01:16:40,920 so I'm heading over to a World Cup fringe event 1332 01:16:41,000 --> 01:16:43,840 to discreetly hand out information 1333 01:16:43,920 --> 01:16:47,560 about my planned protest to the assembled media. 1334 01:17:00,360 --> 01:17:01,720 - Today? - Yeah, today. 1335 01:17:01,800 --> 01:17:04,240 So, if you can come today, that would be brilliant. 1336 01:17:09,000 --> 01:17:11,960 - So... - Ah! 1337 01:17:17,440 --> 01:17:20,640 Although I have very strong convictions, 1338 01:17:20,720 --> 01:17:23,760 I've also got quite debilitating self-doubt. 1339 01:17:25,040 --> 01:17:26,840 There's a fear about failure, 1340 01:17:26,920 --> 01:17:30,920 the worry about arrest and possibly being beaten up. 1341 01:17:31,000 --> 01:17:34,120 I've always got an overpowering headache 1342 01:17:34,200 --> 01:17:35,480 from the nervous tension 1343 01:17:35,560 --> 01:17:37,400 whenever I'm doing a direct action protest. 1344 01:17:38,320 --> 01:17:41,960 My stomach's churning over. I actually feel physically ill. 1345 01:17:43,880 --> 01:17:46,120 [Dramatic music] 1346 01:17:53,320 --> 01:17:56,560 [Horns being blown] 1347 01:18:02,520 --> 01:18:05,120 [Music builds] 1348 01:18:18,160 --> 01:18:20,480 [Horns, whistles] 1349 01:18:21,560 --> 01:18:23,280 Get around this way. 1350 01:18:39,160 --> 01:18:43,640 There can be no normal sporting relation 1351 01:18:43,720 --> 01:18:48,360 with an abnormal regime like that of Vladimir Putin. 1352 01:18:48,440 --> 01:18:52,720 Putin sanctioned the 2013 law... 1353 01:18:52,800 --> 01:18:54,360 Oh, sorry, hi. 1354 01:18:54,440 --> 01:18:56,800 [Man speaking Russian] 1355 01:18:56,880 --> 01:18:59,120 Sorry, Engli, Engli, Engli. 1356 01:18:59,520 --> 01:19:03,160 It's a bit too quickly, an action. 1357 01:19:03,240 --> 01:19:04,760 Can I check your documents, thanks? 1358 01:19:08,680 --> 01:19:11,600 President Putin sanctioned 1359 01:19:11,680 --> 01:19:17,480 the 2013 law that has led to the persecution of LGBT Russians. 1360 01:19:17,560 --> 01:19:18,640 I asked you to stop. 1361 01:19:18,720 --> 01:19:21,520 President Putin has failed to stop the violence, 1362 01:19:21,600 --> 01:19:24,120 anti-gay witch-hunts in Chechnya. 1363 01:19:24,200 --> 01:19:25,680 I asked you to stop your action. 1364 01:19:25,760 --> 01:19:28,240 Even President Putin doesn't have the right 1365 01:19:28,320 --> 01:19:29,560 to override the Constitution. 1366 01:19:29,640 --> 01:19:30,800 I know, but time to... 1367 01:19:30,880 --> 01:19:32,520 I'm being apprehended? 1368 01:19:32,600 --> 01:19:35,040 I want to stay here with the journalists, though. 1369 01:19:35,120 --> 01:19:36,480 No, no, stop. 1370 01:19:36,560 --> 01:19:40,640 I want the Russian government to uphold the Constitution. 1371 01:19:40,720 --> 01:19:42,880 Right now, you're breaking Russian law. 1372 01:19:42,960 --> 01:19:44,440 OK. 1373 01:19:49,720 --> 01:19:52,720 [Dramatic music] 1374 01:19:55,760 --> 01:19:58,880 [Person speaking Russian quietly] 1375 01:19:58,960 --> 01:20:00,720 Detained and charged by Moscow police. 1376 01:20:00,800 --> 01:20:01,800 Holding up a placard 1377 01:20:01,880 --> 01:20:04,360 highlighting the plight of gay men in Chechnya. 1378 01:20:04,440 --> 01:20:07,080 Peter Tatchell didn't feel that he was breaking the law. 1379 01:20:07,160 --> 01:20:11,040 ..who was detained has been released today. 1380 01:20:11,120 --> 01:20:12,200 He joins us now. 1381 01:20:12,280 --> 01:20:14,680 Under President Putin, there has been a long... 1382 01:20:14,760 --> 01:20:16,600 My protest was about 1383 01:20:16,680 --> 01:20:19,160 the criminalisation of LGBT equality. 1384 01:20:20,240 --> 01:20:23,360 Just as I'd hoped, it stole Putin's thunder. 1385 01:20:23,440 --> 01:20:25,600 I want the story 1386 01:20:25,680 --> 01:20:28,280 not to be just about Russia hosting the World Cup. 1387 01:20:28,360 --> 01:20:34,360 It's put LGBT rights in the headlines around the world. 1388 01:20:37,480 --> 01:20:39,840 [Producer] That was fantastic, Peter. Thank you so much. 1389 01:20:39,920 --> 01:20:41,040 Thank you. 1390 01:20:41,120 --> 01:20:43,960 - Take care of yourself. - Yeah, thank you. 1391 01:20:44,040 --> 01:20:46,000 - Bye-bye. - Bye-bye. 1392 01:20:49,040 --> 01:20:51,240 [Exhaling wearily] 1393 01:21:02,320 --> 01:21:05,160 The fact that somebody wants to fight for us, 1394 01:21:05,240 --> 01:21:08,920 and also to put yourself in danger, 1395 01:21:09,000 --> 01:21:12,160 we need that help, we need to raise awareness. 1396 01:21:12,240 --> 01:21:13,880 It's for you. Thank you. 1397 01:21:24,440 --> 01:21:26,800 [Police siren] 1398 01:21:31,000 --> 01:21:34,080 [Gentle music] 1399 01:21:40,960 --> 01:21:45,240 An impression people have of you is that you're a one-man band. 1400 01:21:48,640 --> 01:21:51,320 We're gonna do it as soon as he starts speaking. 1401 01:21:51,400 --> 01:21:52,520 Moves his mouth, yeah. 1402 01:21:52,600 --> 01:21:54,520 All the work I've done over the last five decades 1403 01:21:54,600 --> 01:21:56,600 has been collaborative. 1404 01:21:56,680 --> 01:21:58,160 It's never been me alone. 1405 01:21:58,240 --> 01:21:59,240 Protect human rights. 1406 01:21:59,320 --> 01:22:00,480 Protect human rights in Syria. 1407 01:22:00,560 --> 01:22:03,960 Too vague, too vague. UK airdrops now. 1408 01:22:04,040 --> 01:22:06,680 It's gotta be something specific and concrete. 1409 01:22:06,760 --> 01:22:08,440 I'm often the front person. 1410 01:22:08,520 --> 01:22:10,000 UK airdrops now. 1411 01:22:10,080 --> 01:22:12,200 Without the other people supporting 1412 01:22:12,280 --> 01:22:14,080 and campaigning alongside, 1413 01:22:14,160 --> 01:22:16,240 none of these positive changes would've happened. 1414 01:22:18,280 --> 01:22:19,880 We'd like to ask Jeremy... 1415 01:22:19,960 --> 01:22:21,000 Peter, I think... 1416 01:22:21,080 --> 01:22:24,360 What's happening in Aleppo is a modern-day Guernica. 1417 01:22:24,440 --> 01:22:28,320 Peter, could we leave these sorts of questions, please? 1418 01:22:29,360 --> 01:22:32,160 [Peter] Good morning. Can I give you a leaflet? 1419 01:22:32,240 --> 01:22:35,320 Can I give you a leaflet? Thank you very much. 1420 01:22:35,400 --> 01:22:36,840 Do you feel good about yourself? 1421 01:22:36,920 --> 01:22:39,000 I guess I do, at a certain level, 1422 01:22:39,080 --> 01:22:40,800 feel a sense of self-satisfaction. 1423 01:22:41,840 --> 01:22:46,800 Lay some placards down so people can see the message. 1424 01:22:46,880 --> 01:22:49,000 What does this LGBT? 1425 01:22:49,080 --> 01:22:50,600 It means gay people. 1426 01:22:50,680 --> 01:22:52,880 Why you coming here? Why you don't go to synagogue? 1427 01:22:52,960 --> 01:22:54,600 Go to synagogue. - We do both. 1428 01:22:54,680 --> 01:22:56,360 - Or church. - We do both. 1429 01:22:56,440 --> 01:22:58,400 We're here at Regents Park Mosque today, 1430 01:22:58,480 --> 01:23:00,720 reaching out to our Muslim brothers and sisters. 1431 01:23:00,800 --> 01:23:02,080 We want to create dialogue 1432 01:23:02,160 --> 01:23:04,720 so we can live in peace and harmony together for the future. 1433 01:23:05,640 --> 01:23:08,960 The challenges that the Muslims and LGBT people face 1434 01:23:09,040 --> 01:23:10,200 are very similar - 1435 01:23:10,280 --> 01:23:12,320 discrimination in the workplace 1436 01:23:12,400 --> 01:23:14,440 or being the victims of hate crime. 1437 01:23:14,520 --> 01:23:16,320 We're trying to encourage solidarity 1438 01:23:16,400 --> 01:23:17,880 between Muslim people and gay people. 1439 01:23:17,960 --> 01:23:21,160 - When you become homosexual... - Yeah. 1440 01:23:21,240 --> 01:23:24,000 - ..you need to have that fixed. - No, that's not true. 1441 01:23:24,080 --> 01:23:25,440 Yes, yes, that's it. 1442 01:23:26,120 --> 01:23:30,440 I've contributed, with others, to so many positive changes. 1443 01:23:30,520 --> 01:23:31,840 Salaam-alaikum. 1444 01:23:31,920 --> 01:23:35,800 I can see so many injustices that need fighting. 1445 01:23:35,880 --> 01:23:37,680 There are certain sins, do you understand? 1446 01:23:37,760 --> 01:23:40,040 There's nothing explicitly in the Quran 1447 01:23:40,120 --> 01:23:41,520 that says homosexuality is wrong. 1448 01:23:41,600 --> 01:23:43,440 There's no punishments in the Quran. 1449 01:23:43,520 --> 01:23:48,040 I'm also the kind of person that never feels satisfied. 1450 01:23:48,120 --> 01:23:50,280 When I have a victory, I don't dwell on it very much. 1451 01:23:50,360 --> 01:23:52,000 I just think - what's next? 1452 01:23:52,080 --> 01:23:54,720 [Singing and chanting] 1453 01:23:56,160 --> 01:23:59,760 Looking back over my life, I feel satisfaction 1454 01:23:59,840 --> 01:24:03,720 that, together with others, we've shown 1455 01:24:03,800 --> 01:24:07,840 that you don't have to accept the way things are. 1456 01:24:07,920 --> 01:24:10,160 You have led us through this... 1457 01:24:10,240 --> 01:24:13,040 No, I have not led you, I have supported you. 1458 01:24:13,120 --> 01:24:14,280 I have supported you. 1459 01:24:14,360 --> 01:24:15,800 I love other people. 1460 01:24:15,880 --> 01:24:19,200 I love freedom, equality and justice, 1461 01:24:19,280 --> 01:24:21,200 and that's what drives me forward. 1462 01:24:21,280 --> 01:24:23,360 I don't like to see people suffering. 1463 01:24:23,440 --> 01:24:26,440 [Singing and chanting] 1464 01:24:28,800 --> 01:24:31,840 It's very unusual in a political lifetime 1465 01:24:31,920 --> 01:24:34,800 to have one figure symbolising a cause, 1466 01:24:34,880 --> 01:24:38,360 and being active over such a long period of time. 1467 01:24:38,440 --> 01:24:43,200 There's no doubting his passion, his sincerity, his devotion, 1468 01:24:43,280 --> 01:24:44,960 but, above all, his courage. 1469 01:24:45,040 --> 01:24:46,800 History will judge Peter Tatchell 1470 01:24:46,880 --> 01:24:50,400 as one of the most interesting, brave, passionate 1471 01:24:50,480 --> 01:24:53,000 and effective campaigners. 1472 01:24:53,080 --> 01:24:58,400 He still holds out a vision of liberation 1473 01:24:58,480 --> 01:25:00,400 for all people. 1474 01:25:00,480 --> 01:25:03,360 He's identifying injustices around the world, 1475 01:25:03,440 --> 01:25:05,840 and going and highlighting them. 1476 01:25:06,640 --> 01:25:09,600 With your track record, you've been proved right 1477 01:25:09,680 --> 01:25:12,680 again and again and again, 1478 01:25:12,760 --> 01:25:17,040 and the world has caught up with you. 1479 01:25:17,120 --> 01:25:19,200 Our next guest is a notorious pulpit crasher 1480 01:25:19,280 --> 01:25:20,520 and gay rights activist. 1481 01:25:20,600 --> 01:25:23,480 Please welcome 120 pounds of pink fury, 1482 01:25:23,560 --> 01:25:25,160 Peter Tatchell, ladies and gentlemen. 1483 01:25:25,240 --> 01:25:28,560 In the Bible, it's OK to sell your daughter into slavery. 1484 01:25:28,640 --> 01:25:29,840 Um... 1485 01:25:29,920 --> 01:25:30,880 You don't hear any advice 1486 01:25:30,960 --> 01:25:33,320 from the Pope or the Archbishop of Canterbury about how much... 1487 01:25:33,400 --> 01:25:34,560 what the going price is. 1488 01:25:34,640 --> 01:25:39,320 My assessment of Peter now 1489 01:25:39,400 --> 01:25:43,640 is that he's been a figure for good and equality. 1490 01:25:43,720 --> 01:25:47,200 Here is a man with deep conviction. 1491 01:25:50,040 --> 01:25:52,360 He's rocked the boat. 1492 01:25:52,440 --> 01:25:53,800 And there's a sense in which 1493 01:25:53,880 --> 01:25:56,040 there is a parallel to Jesus Christ. 1494 01:26:00,560 --> 01:26:04,000 Jesus was prepared to stand up against 1495 01:26:04,080 --> 01:26:08,880 the powerful people in society, represent the smaller people. 1496 01:26:10,120 --> 01:26:14,800 Where some of us might still question his tactics, no-one 1497 01:26:14,880 --> 01:26:20,880 can actually doubt that he's on the right side of history. 1498 01:26:26,520 --> 01:26:28,320 Makes you feel so humbled 1499 01:26:28,400 --> 01:26:30,960 to think that Peter's so well regarded. 1500 01:26:32,400 --> 01:26:36,840 My mother initially could not accept my homosexuality, 1501 01:26:36,920 --> 01:26:40,920 but she began to accept that I was motivated 1502 01:26:41,000 --> 01:26:45,400 by the kinds of moral principles that underpin Christianity. 1503 01:26:46,120 --> 01:26:49,840 I've shown him how to be compassionate towards people, 1504 01:26:49,920 --> 01:26:51,320 I think, 1505 01:26:51,400 --> 01:26:53,320 and to stand up for what he believes in, 1506 01:26:53,400 --> 01:26:57,080 and do what he believes is right. 1507 01:26:57,160 --> 01:26:58,320 Although she's still 1508 01:26:58,400 --> 01:27:00,040 uncomfortable with homosexuality, 1509 01:27:00,120 --> 01:27:02,160 she doesn't see it as a great terrible sin. 1510 01:27:02,240 --> 01:27:03,760 It's a minor sin. 1511 01:27:13,200 --> 01:27:17,320 How would you feel one day if she called you up and said, 1512 01:27:17,400 --> 01:27:19,760 "Peter, I've been wrong all these years"? 1513 01:27:19,840 --> 01:27:21,000 It isn't gonna happen. 1514 01:27:21,080 --> 01:27:22,480 It's not gonna happen? Alright. 1515 01:27:31,600 --> 01:27:33,360 I just say to myself, 1516 01:27:33,440 --> 01:27:36,400 "Peter's happy, and I love him, 1517 01:27:36,480 --> 01:27:39,200 "and, if he's happy, then I am, too, 1518 01:27:39,280 --> 01:27:41,440 "doing what you want to do, yes." 1519 01:27:41,520 --> 01:27:43,480 Thank you, Mum. 1520 01:27:50,160 --> 01:27:53,600 [Cheering] 1521 01:27:56,320 --> 01:27:58,280 [Newsreader] Soccer's world governing body, FIFA, 1522 01:27:58,360 --> 01:28:02,120 has chosen Qatar to stage the tournament in 2022. 1523 01:28:04,040 --> 01:28:05,720 It's the first time the World Cup 1524 01:28:05,800 --> 01:28:07,480 will be played in the Arab world. 1525 01:28:07,560 --> 01:28:12,040 [Peter] Qatar has a very poor record on LGBT human rights. 1526 01:28:13,920 --> 01:28:17,120 My plan is to work with Qatari dissidents 1527 01:28:17,200 --> 01:28:19,040 to help shine a spotlight 1528 01:28:19,120 --> 01:28:21,640 on the human rights abuses in their country. 1529 01:28:22,920 --> 01:28:24,920 [Cheering] 1530 01:28:43,640 --> 01:28:46,840 [Elton John] ♪ I believe in love ♪ 1531 01:28:46,920 --> 01:28:50,040 ♪ It's all we got ♪ 1532 01:28:50,120 --> 01:28:53,520 ♪ Love has no boundaries ♪ 1533 01:28:53,600 --> 01:28:56,640 ♪ Costs nothing to touch ♪ 1534 01:28:58,840 --> 01:29:04,440 ♪ War makes money cancer sleeps ♪ 1535 01:29:04,520 --> 01:29:10,000 ♪ Curled up in my father and that means something to me ♪ 1536 01:29:10,080 --> 01:29:14,320 ♪ Churches and dictators 1537 01:29:14,400 --> 01:29:18,120 ♪ Politics and papers ♪ 1538 01:29:18,200 --> 01:29:21,680 ♪ Everything crumbles 1539 01:29:21,760 --> 01:29:25,240 ♪ Sooner or later ♪ 1540 01:29:25,320 --> 01:29:30,080 ♪ But love ♪ 1541 01:29:30,160 --> 01:29:33,840 ♪ I believe in love ♪ 1542 01:29:40,000 --> 01:29:45,400 ♪ I believe in love it's all we got ♪ 1543 01:29:45,480 --> 01:29:51,200 ♪ Love has no boundaries no borders to cross ♪ 1544 01:29:53,800 --> 01:29:56,840 ♪ Love is simple ♪ 1545 01:29:56,920 --> 01:29:59,360 ♪ Hate breeds ♪ 1546 01:30:00,360 --> 01:30:06,360 ♪ Those who think difference is the child of disease ♪ 1547 01:30:07,800 --> 01:30:13,720 ♪ Father and son make love and guns ♪ 1548 01:30:13,800 --> 01:30:19,440 ♪ Families together kill someone ♪ 1549 01:30:19,520 --> 01:30:25,440 ♪ Without love ♪ 1550 01:30:25,520 --> 01:30:29,520 ♪ I believe in love ♪